Daredevil Message Board
The Board Without Fear!
 
 FAQFAQ   SearchSearch   MemberlistMemberlist   UsergroupsUsergroups   RegisterRegister 
 ProfileProfile   Log in to check your private messagesLog in to check your private messages   Log inLog in 

The Message Board is currently in read-only mode, as the software is now out of date. Several features and pages have been removed. If/When I get time I intend to re-launch the board with updated software.


DAREDEVIL: END OF DAYS #8 SPOILERS!
Goto page 1, 2, 3  Next
 
Post new topic   Reply to topic    Daredevil Message Board Forum Index -> The comics
View previous topic :: View next topic  
Author Message
Kuljit Mithra
Hardcore


Joined: 29 Jul 2004
Posts: 1530
Location: Canada

PostPosted: Fri Jun 07, 2013 10:29 am    Post subject: DAREDEVIL: END OF DAYS #8 SPOILERS! Reply with quote

DAREDEVIL: END OF DAYS #8 has come out this week and concluded the storyline...

Here was a small preview (which has spoilers, as does this thread on the board, so stop reading if you haven't read it yet)

http://www.manwithoutfear.com/gallery/Daredevil-End-Of-Days-8


So, what do you think of the Mapone reveal?
_________________
Kuljit Mithra
www.manwithoutfear.com
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Francesco
Underboss


Joined: 08 Jun 2006
Posts: 1307

PostPosted: Fri Jun 07, 2013 11:17 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

that it was predictably dumb and that the miniseries turned out not to be this big fat masterpiece everyone anticipated it to be. the regular series is better by far.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
DesignDevil
Playing to the Camera


Joined: 11 Sep 2009
Posts: 157
Location: Tennessee

PostPosted: Fri Jun 07, 2013 12:48 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I am so glad I didn't spend any money on this series. Shadowland was a better DD story and I hated Shadowland. This entire mini read like it was fanfiction written by a 15 year old. A 15 year old who has read Miller's and Bendis' Daredevil stories way too many times and missed the point of what made those stories great every time.

Ha ha Murdock has lots of bastard kids, get it, cause he's a whore.
Thats so clever and funny and edgy. Ha ha.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Dimetre
Underboss


Joined: 16 Feb 2006
Posts: 1366
Location: Toronto

PostPosted: Fri Jun 07, 2013 4:34 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Wow.

I just finished reading a review of #8 at http://www.craveonline.com/comics/reviews/513319-daredevil-end-of-days-8.

I feel completely justified for dropping this series after the first issue. I gave it a chance due to my respect for David Mack and Bill Sienkiewicz, but I may never by anything connected to Bendis ever again.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website
Gee
Playing to the Camera


Joined: 09 Feb 2005
Posts: 119
Location: Scotland

PostPosted: Fri Jun 07, 2013 6:16 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Awful, just awful, I bought most of the series and really regret it, always thought Bendis was terrible but hoped that the art etc could make this worth it, it was not.
_________________
when walking just walk, when sitting just sit, above all don't wobble.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail
theunrealstudios
Playing to the Camera


Joined: 14 Sep 2010
Posts: 137
Location: Toronto

PostPosted: Sat Jun 08, 2013 8:55 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

i can't even begin to express how disappointed with this train wreck to you guys.

i suppose when the very first issue depicts my favorite hero being murdered with his own club by a villain he's bested dozens of times i knew it was going to be bad.

Mapone was such a lame reveal and Timmy.... seriously?

I guess this shows we really don't want Ben Urich monopolizing a story and failing to remind us why we like Matt so much. Sure maybe they don't want to do a Miller dark knight returns but this was so afraid of taking risks with supporting characters that references were vague and uninteresting anyways.

In short no one here is going to take this into continuity.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Dimetre
Underboss


Joined: 16 Feb 2006
Posts: 1366
Location: Toronto

PostPosted: Sat Jun 08, 2013 9:01 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

theunrealstudios wrote:
I guess this shows we really don't want Ben Urich monopolizing a story and failing to remind us why we like Matt so much.

Maybe dumping on Bendis has become a hobby of mine, but I can't hold back. I just have to point out that Bendis' very first work at Marvel, the Wake Up arc (vol. 2 #16-19 I think) pushed Ben Urich to the foreground and shoved Daredevil into the background. I found it very tedious, and I thought it would have been more honest to market it has a Ben Urich mini-series.

So many years later, and Bendis hasn't progressed at all.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website
Gianni
Flying Blind


Joined: 16 Oct 2012
Posts: 26
Location: Italy

PostPosted: Sun Jun 09, 2013 4:11 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Big disappointment. My main concern is about the fact that the famous last word seemed to have had an impact on Bullseye, to the point that we were (I was, anyway) induced to believe that pronouncing that word was the reason for the killing. And the whole story was presented as if the reveal of the word's meaning would have made clear the sense of many things, e.g. Daredevil brutally killing the Kingpin, then disappearing only to come back and get killed... Needless to say, the final reveal didn't reveal anything and stretching this fake "mistery" along 8 issues was just pointless und not very honest
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Daredevil24
Humanity's Fathom


Joined: 06 Apr 2011
Posts: 367

PostPosted: Mon Jun 10, 2013 6:50 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I pretty much agree with everybody else.Bullseye's death was silly.Bullseye being able to kill Daredevil easily without an explanation was silly too.The only real pay off for me was to see Daredevil and Black Widow together again.But there is just way too many unanswered questions.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Skaughtto
Flying Blind


Joined: 09 Apr 2013
Posts: 25

PostPosted: Mon Jun 10, 2013 7:57 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I waited until I had all the comics to read the series. In the beginning I felt like I was reading something that was going to be earth shattering, but by the end it felt formulaic. It didn't need to span eight issues to get where it was going.

Timmy felt like a lame choice. If Ben Urich was perceptive enough to find out Matt Murdock was DD, I bet he could have figured out his own kid was up to something. I haven't read anything where Matt and Tim have any sort of a relationship, so there was a major disconnect for me.

Bullseye killing himself felt out of character and anticlimactic.

I would have felt more satisfied if Mapone were a sled...

The artwork in the series is top notch, but the story didn't live up to my expectations. In the end it was average.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message AIM Address
james castle
Devil in Cell-Block D


Joined: 30 Jul 2004
Posts: 1999
Location: Toronto, Ontario

PostPosted: Sun Jul 28, 2013 2:03 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Holy crap, thank god for this website.

I picked up the End of Days HC last week. I'd been avoiding spoilers but I had a sense that everyone really loved the mini. I was vaguely aware of some of the big sites gushing about it.

I read the thing in two sittings. Long story short: it's unbelievably terrible. After finishing the laughably bad final issue I went to look up some reviews because who doesn't love a good negative review? To my surprise a bunch of reviews were raving. 5 out of 5s. "Masterpiece".

Finally, I came here to vent and, thank heavens, everyone here knows was garbage. I guess some of the big sites just couldn't get past the hype.

In any event, so, so, so let down. I think this goes in the pile with Daredevil: Father and Battlin' Jack Murdock; "big deal" Daredevil minis that were, in the end, trash.

I agree with what everyone has said above. For me, though, the real kicker was the kids. So Matt had a daughter with Natasha, twins with Mary, a boy with Elektra and another with Echo (check out her desk). Five kids? And when the hell did he have these kids? Timmy was about 9 in Wake Up and he's, what, 20 in End of Days? Maybe 25? So we're 16 years later? But Mapone looks a lot older than 16. And she could only be 16 if she was born during Wake Up, which we know she wasn't. So, she's.....10?

Even crazier, all the boys appear much, much younger than Mapone. So Matt had a girl with Natasha and THEN went and had a kid/kids with every other love interest except Milla?

What was the motivation for giving him 5 kids in the first place? It's insane.

Terrible, terrible series.
_________________
JC

So why can't you see the funny side?
Why aren't you laughing?
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail
qtmxd
Playing to the Camera


Joined: 19 Sep 2010
Posts: 149

PostPosted: Sun Jul 28, 2013 7:27 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I read the HC a couple of weeks ago, still musing a bit. While I certainly agree it wasn't great, I definitely don't share the vehemence of just about everyone who's commented so far. Maybe some of it is just contrast... having suffered through the Rivera/Samnee era, which I hate, the artwork was a feast for me. Sienkiewicz is always excellent, and it's nice to see how good Mack can bewhen he actually finishes a picture himself instead of scribbling a few lines and collaging something with school paste. And when he's not doing Cap and Wolverine cliches and big explosions for Avengers, Bendis can still do some excellent writing. All the female interviews were well done. Milla especially (though I could have done without the sight...why do all fictional blind girls find out at age 25 that there's an "operation" to restore their sight?). An excellent an neglected creation of Bendis, she thought she had a fairy tale romance with Matt/DD, and is now understandably bitter. The first kid was hers, btw, though given her state of mind, I wouldn't want to be that kid. I also thought it was reasonable for Matt to have a couple of kids, but agree that the number of them, all of them clones, was kind of ridiculous. I thought this was his revenge for being a second-tier character... in 20 years, he gets to re-populate the Marvel Universe.
I think a lot of the problem of the story was the "surprise ending" structure, kind of a guarantee for disappointment. No revelation can justify plodding through 8 issues. And in Matt's story, I want to see Matt, not all Ben Urich. I wonder how a straightforward chronological story would have worked ... Matt with Natasha, training Mapone, till the end. The first issue was probably the worst... Bullseye killing DD is unacceptable, and the hero getting fed up and finally killing the villain is a cliche by now. If there was anything in either death more than that, it was too subtle for me to catch, as was why the mere mention of Mapone would drive Bullseye to suicide. Another reason to tell the story straight and develop these ideas,, without all this mystery substituting for writing. Another smaller disappointment was that I thought Bendis had promised some surprise characters, and there weren't any, just too much Punisher routine. I guess I should be glad it wasn't Spider-Man taking over again. Overall, agreed, not great, but enough there that I was glad to have read it and taken in the art.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Sparko
Flying Blind


Joined: 13 Feb 2013
Posts: 33

PostPosted: Wed Jul 31, 2013 10:04 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I will end up re-reading this, and potentially buying the trade paperback when it's out, as I'm interested in having all if not most of the Daredevil books out. Essentially though, this was a letdown for me.
What about "Mapone" made Bullseye lose it so bad, enough to at least kill himself, or write the name all over the wall before he killed himself? What relationship did Bullseye have with Mapone? Had they ever been face to face? Did Mapone ever best Bullseye in a fight?
I can buy that Bullseye managed to get the best of Matt here, and in true villainous form, he took full advantage of besting him in a fight and killed him. Good guys can lose too, right? Matt may have been more reserved (outside of Shadowland), because of his good guy nature, but Bullseye had always been a killer. And Daredevil isn't the Punisher after all so he never took out Bullseye when he had the chance (outside of Shadowland).
But what about Mapone made Bullseye lose it enough to kill himself? Was it that really that he no longer felt complete without his arch nemesis? Did he write the name because he somehow knew Urich was on this hunt and he wanted to do a last act for redemption? The Joker has been written once or more where he needs Batman. It's a sick symbiosis. It's Tom and Jerry on acid and too many anti-depressants. Maybe that’s why Bullseye wacked himself out.
Could the story have been better if Mapone was introduced much earlier and only at the end did she introduce herself as Stick?
I liked that Urich was the story teller and the story revolved around his investigation. I actually liked “Wake Up” and while I could have seen it as a Urich mini, it still felt appropriate enough to be in Daredevil’s book. I’m a big fan of the art in the book. The dark grittiness is a story teller in itself. I kind of liked seeing Matt’s kids all over. It was unexpected to say the least. I even liked that his daughter Mapone ended up being the one who would teach Timmy to be Daredevil. I liked how she took that Stick persona.
Overall, I’m only giving this 2.25 stars out of 5. I liked the concept, and I loved the art, but the execution of the concept just kills it for me. I’m left utterly disappointed after my first reading. Maybe I expected too much from this, but it was warranted. I loved Bendis’ run on the actual book, and to this day, it’s some of my favorite story telling.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
james castle
Devil in Cell-Block D


Joined: 30 Jul 2004
Posts: 1999
Location: Toronto, Ontario

PostPosted: Wed Jul 31, 2013 2:11 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Sparko wrote:

What about "Mapone" made Bullseye lose it so bad, enough to at least kill himself, or write the name all over the wall before he killed himself? What relationship did Bullseye have with Mapone? Had they ever been face to face? Did Mapone ever best Bullseye in a fight?


Well, buckle up for THE WORST IDEA YOU'VE EVER HEARD because the hardcover actually has a script page from a cut scene that, according to Mack, sheds light on why "Mapone" nade Bulls kill himself. I'm paraphrasing but, basically, in the scene Punisher tells someone (I think Tim) that Bullseye once had a foster mom that he like that he killed by mistake. It was the only time Bullseye missed. The foster mom's name was....my god, even typing this hurts...Rosemary Pone. Get it? Mother Pone. Mama Pone. Ma Pone. MAPONE!

I'm not even kidding. That was apparently in the script but was cut.

At least it was cut. The problems with this terrible idea are mind boggling. First, it's completely made up. It's not clever or interesting to just make up random, convenient facts. It's just a bunch of random exposition that, in theory, makes things fit.

Second...really? It just means that, completely randomly Daredevil happened to name his daughter a made up name that sounded like the mom Bullseye killed? Jesus.

Speaking of which: I read an interview where Mack points out that "Mapone" is a city in Europe somewhere. He says that that's where Matt and Natasha conceived Mapone and goes on to say "it's common for people to be named after the city that they were conceived in". Wait. What? Are they? I guess that explains all the New Yorks, Bogotas and Torontos running around. Ridiculous.
_________________
JC

So why can't you see the funny side?
Why aren't you laughing?
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail
qtmxd
Playing to the Camera


Joined: 19 Sep 2010
Posts: 149

PostPosted: Wed Jul 31, 2013 2:16 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I read that page, and still don't understand it. You're trying to explain it, but I suspect it's hopeless. Maybe Bendis and Mack need to stop being coy, and say what it means, instead of all this "let the reader fill in the blanks" non-writing. And Mapone is in Mozambique, but that's all I can find about it. I still don't even know how to pronounce it.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Display posts from previous:   
Post new topic   Reply to topic    Daredevil Message Board Forum Index -> The comics All times are GMT - 4 Hours
Goto page 1, 2, 3  Next
Page 1 of 3

 
Jump to:  
You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot vote in polls in this forum


Powered by phpBB © phpBB Group