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UPDATED: Shadowland, a Daredevil mini from Marvel *SPOILERS*
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Marvel Knight
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Joined: 21 Aug 2007
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Location: Kingston, ON, Canada

PostPosted: Thu May 27, 2010 4:29 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Foggy's Pal wrote:
I haven't read every solicit with a fine tooth comb, so this question may be silly. Will DD be in every tie-in. I know they will mostly focus on other characters, but I wasn't sure how much of a role DD will play in these. Anyone?


He will not be in every tie-in, although the writers have said his "presence will be felt."
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Dimetre
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PostPosted: Tue Jun 01, 2010 11:49 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Something I find puzzling about Shadowland, even before it kicks off is this: Daredevil ordered the construction of Shadowland in response to the bombing of that housing complex, which was ordered by Norman Osborn. Following that, Daredevil has been leading the Hand in an effort to cleanse Hell's Kitchen of all remnants of H.A.M.M.E.R. But, now that Siege is over, Norman Osborn has been stripped of power, and H.A.M.M.E.R. appears to be a memory (although there still seems to be remnants of it in Black Widow #2). Steve Rogers appears to be the new leader of S.H.I.E.L.D. So, what the hell is Daredevil doing, and why is this Shadowland drama going to take up the rest of 2010? Isn't the problem that Daredevil was addressing with Shadowland already fixed?
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Marvel Knight
Playing to the Camera


Joined: 21 Aug 2007
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Location: Kingston, ON, Canada

PostPosted: Tue Jun 01, 2010 9:18 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Dimetre wrote:
Something I find puzzling about Shadowland, even before it kicks off is this: Daredevil ordered the construction of Shadowland in response to the bombing of that housing complex, which was ordered by Norman Osborn. Following that, Daredevil has been leading the Hand in an effort to cleanse Hell's Kitchen of all remnants of H.A.M.M.E.R. But, now that Siege is over, Norman Osborn has been stripped of power, and H.A.M.M.E.R. appears to be a memory (although there still seems to be remnants of it in Black Widow #2). Steve Rogers appears to be the new leader of S.H.I.E.L.D. So, what the hell is Daredevil doing, and why is this Shadowland drama going to take up the rest of 2010? Isn't the problem that Daredevil was addressing with Shadowland already fixed?


I thought Rogers was not re-instating S.H.I.E.L.D. He is the top cop and all, but all he has done is put a couple Avengers teams together. Is S.H.I.E.L.D. really functioning again?
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Foggy's Pal
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PostPosted: Fri Jun 04, 2010 6:55 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Dimetre wrote:
Something I find puzzling about Shadowland, even before it kicks off is this: Daredevil ordered the construction of Shadowland in response to the bombing of that housing complex, which was ordered by Norman Osborn. Following that, Daredevil has been leading the Hand in an effort to cleanse Hell's Kitchen of all remnants of H.A.M.M.E.R. But, now that Siege is over, Norman Osborn has been stripped of power, and H.A.M.M.E.R. appears to be a memory (although there still seems to be remnants of it in Black Widow #2). Steve Rogers appears to be the new leader of S.H.I.E.L.D. So, what the hell is Daredevil doing, and why is this Shadowland drama going to take up the rest of 2010? Isn't the problem that Daredevil was addressing with Shadowland already fixed?


It would appear from the preview of 507 that Shadowland wasn't even Matt's idea, but an idea planted by the Hand.
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Kuljit Mithra
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PostPosted: Sun Jun 06, 2010 11:14 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Some more details from Heroes Con, with editor Bill Rosemann and Thunderbolts writer Jeff Parker:

http://www.comicbookresources.com/?page=article&id=26554
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Kuljit Mithra
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Kuljit Mithra
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PostPosted: Thu Jun 10, 2010 5:25 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Teaser #9 has been released, this time with DD maybe making a trip to the dark side...

http://www.manwithoutfear.com/gallery/Shadowland/SHADOWLANDteaser9
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Marvel Knight
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PostPosted: Thu Jun 10, 2010 10:42 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Kuljit Mithra wrote:
Teaser #9 has been released, this time with DD maybe making a trip to the dark side...

http://www.manwithoutfear.com/gallery/Shadowland/SHADOWLANDteaser9


I'm not sure hot I feel about that yet. lol

Very interesting.
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Dre
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PostPosted: Thu Jun 10, 2010 11:01 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Marvel Knight wrote:
Kuljit Mithra wrote:
Teaser #9 has been released, this time with DD maybe making a trip to the dark side...

http://www.manwithoutfear.com/gallery/Shadowland/SHADOWLANDteaser9


I'm not sure hot I feel about that yet. lol

Very interesting.
About what? DD as a "villain", as he's being branded purely for hype, I'm sure?
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Kuljit Mithra
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PostPosted: Fri Jun 11, 2010 6:13 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

And today we get teaser 10, which shows Bullseye getting the sharp end of a sword...

http://www.manwithoutfear.com/gallery/Shadowland/SHADOWLANDteaser10
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Francesco
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PostPosted: Sat Jun 12, 2010 3:28 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Even if DD killed Bullseye, it wouldn't be that big a deal, in my opinion. DD has often killed those who put innocents in danger, and what's actually surprising is how he's kept himself from NOT killing Bullseye until now.
I suspect that the teaser is just a ploy, and that DD will kill someone else, someone whose assassination at the hands of DD will have a much more shocking effect.
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Foggy's Pal
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PostPosted: Sat Jun 12, 2010 10:40 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

This whole villain thing got me thinking. If Marvel was going to switch writers, this would be the perfect opportunity. Think about it: Bendis put him in jail, Bru made him leader of the Hand, Diggle makes him a villain. Obviously Matt would never be a true villain, but someone like Garth Ennis or Jason Aaron could work with that.
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Dimetre
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PostPosted: Sat Jun 12, 2010 11:31 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Francesco wrote:
Even if DD killed Bullseye, it wouldn't be that big a deal, in my opinion. DD has often killed those who put innocents in danger, and what's actually surprising is how he's kept himself from NOT killing Bullseye until now.

I find it sad that a Daredevil fan can view Matt as someone who would allow himself the option to kill. Historically, that's a territory he would never allow himself to enter.

Yes, in #181 he dropped Bullseye from the guywire. But his first instinct was to save him, and Bullseye was not going to have that, and attempted to kill Daredevil, who then let go of him. I don't think Bullseye was giving him much of a choice.

Yes, in born again, he blew up a helicopter with the pilot inside. But the pilot was killing civilians, and Daredevil had got his hands on Nuke's weapon. He couldn't allow more civilians to die. He fired and immediately asked for forgiveness.

Those are the two instances I can think of from Volume 1. In Volume 2 before Diggle, I can't think of Daredevil killing anybody (although I did skip the second half of Bendis' run). With Diggle, Daredevil has led the slaughter / torture of H.A.M.M.E.R. agents. I now believe that his behaviour can be explained because he is under the control of the Hand.

But my point is that I have always looked at Daredevil as a hero with a very strong moral centre who doesn't allow himself to waver. Read "The Death of Jean De Wolfe." Read David Lapham's "Daredevil vs. Punisher." To that end, read any encounter between Daredevil and Punisher in Volume 1. He was the noblest of characters. I'm hoping one day he can get back to that.
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Stephan
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PostPosted: Sat Jun 12, 2010 1:28 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Whenever The Hand has resuscitated a Marvel character (the attempted resurrection of Elektra, the resurrection of Doctor Octopus, etc.) the aim has always been to control the character. It is indeed likely that since Matt's revival by The Hand in DD Volume #2 #80, he has slowly come under The Hand's influence. Matt has undoubtedly put up a valiant struggle psychologically and emotionally - but he is now succumbing.

I cannot recall the last time Matt had a so-called "thought balloon." Perhaps there is a reason for this. It is entrirely possible that Marvel does not want the readers to fully understand the inner conflict that has been brewing within the protagonist.
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Francesco
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PostPosted: Sat Jun 12, 2010 2:25 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
Yes, in born again, he blew up a helicopter with the pilot inside. But the pilot was killing civilians, and Daredevil had got his hands on Nuke's weapon. He couldn't allow more civilians to die.


And how is that different from what I said? I think it's pretty simple: you put civilian lives at risk while DD is around? Well, watch out, because it's highly likely that DD will kill you for that.
This is what is historically proven, more than "he would never allow himself to enter that territory".
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Foggy's Pal
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PostPosted: Sat Jun 12, 2010 7:21 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Kind of bummed to see that all the tie-in books will carry the $4 price tag. I was hoping they would be $3.
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