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DAREDEVIL #600 Preview, Reviews and Discussion
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What did you think of DAREDEVIL #600?
5
14%
 14%  [ 1 ]
4
42%
 42%  [ 3 ]
3
28%
 28%  [ 2 ]
2
14%
 14%  [ 1 ]
1
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Total Votes : 7

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Mike Murdock
Golden Age


Joined: 08 Sep 2014
Posts: 1750

PostPosted: Mon Apr 02, 2018 6:20 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I don't think they'll have him reveal his identity twice to Danny, Luke, and Jessica. Marvel is one continuity and, at some point, an editor will catch it.
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Dimetre
Underboss


Joined: 16 Feb 2006
Posts: 1366
Location: Toronto

PostPosted: Mon Apr 02, 2018 1:25 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I didn't expect to be so underwhelmed by the landmark 600th issue.

Ron Garney's artwork seems more rushed and scratchy than ever. I'm at a loss why so many heroes are in this issue when so few of them do anything. Muse didn't interact with Daredevil at all in this book, and I'm disappointed that Charles Soule is putting so much effort into building up this rivalry between Muse and Blindspot. Muse is the best Daredevil villain to come along in years, but we're already trying to take him away from Daredevil.

I don't know why Blindspot wasn't using his invisibility powers. I didn't like the way Garney was portraying Matt's radar sense. I couldn't tell exactly what Sam did when he used the power of the Beast.

The cliffhanger was the best thing about the issue, but this was a big let-down for me. I think I've had my fill of Soule, and I'm hoping Fresh Start brings a new creative team to this book. I think it's time for Blindspot to take his leave from the pages of Daredevil as well.

As for the back-up feature, it was a good look at Foggy, but I'm surprised that they show Matt in a hospital bed instead of Foggy, since he's the one who fought cancer. That was a huge time in their relationship as far as I'm concerned.

I gave this a two.
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Daredevil24
Humanity's Fathom


Joined: 06 Apr 2011
Posts: 367

PostPosted: Mon Apr 02, 2018 10:19 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Mike Murdock wrote:
I don't think they'll have him reveal his identity twice to Danny, Luke, and Jessica. Marvel is one continuity and, at some point, an editor will catch it.
He already did that in the Defenders comics. They know who he is again.
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Daredevil24
Humanity's Fathom


Joined: 06 Apr 2011
Posts: 367

PostPosted: Mon Apr 02, 2018 10:30 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I really would like Sam to disappear for a bit. I still feel he stole a lot of Matt's thunder in this milestone issue which is just wrong. The character had potential but he hasn't reached it and I'm tired of waiting for him to do it. He's a genius that could be useful but as of now he adds nothing to the Daredevil mythos. Why did Matt decide to train him? What did he see in him that was so special that it made him bypass the violent dangers of his world and take him under his wing?

And while I don't mind Matt not dating yet another new woman the relationship absence is clearly noticeable. Me personally would like a new take on Daredevil/Elektra but that's just me. This issue just wasn't what it should have been.
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macjr33
Flying Blind


Joined: 22 Nov 2017
Posts: 97
Location: Pittsburgh, PA

PostPosted: Tue Apr 03, 2018 5:55 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Daredevil24 wrote:
And while I don't mind Matt not dating yet another new woman the relationship absence is clearly noticeable. Me personally would like a new take on Daredevil/Elektra but that's just me. This issue just wasn't what it should have been.


I completely agree with this and, in my opinion, is even more magnified with him not having a relationship for Foggy either. To me what separates Matt from say Batman, is that Matt very much wants to try and live the dual life of both Matt Murdock the lawyer and Daredevil. To that end, he very much values the relationships that he has with those that are important to him. When you think of the most impactful story arcs for Matt they are often built around the relationships he has with those around him like his relationship with his father, the death of Elektra and Karen, how he and Karen reconciled in Born Again, Daredevil: Yellow, his life falling apart during the Bendis/Brubaker run and it leading to his failed marriage, Foggy getting cancer, learning the truth of why his Mom left. These were so powerful because of the connection Matt has with others that are important to him and is rather unique to Matt in the comic world. I feel that aspect is missing from Soule's run as I certainly do not feel that connection with Sam.

Another aspect of it is that while I certainly detest people like Kevin Smith's false interpretation of Matt as a womanizer, as he is NOT Tony Stark. I do, however, think that Matt is a very suave and charismatic particularly with women, almost an antithesis of Spider-Man in that regard. I think Waid did a good job of showcasing that in a much more positive light then Smith did and that is something fun that I like seeing in the comics that further differentiates Matt.

As for who he should be dating, I am pretty open in the regard. A fresh look at Matt/Elektra could be nice though with all the history between them it may be a bit hard to pull off. Similarly, my dream would be for him to be with Natasha, which is also not going to happen.

Other existing characters I wouldn't mind seeing would be bringing back Echo as to me I am not sure I have ever seen Matt more genuinely happy with someone (outside of the last panel in Born Again with Karen) then he was when he was on the date with Maya. I think Jen Walters is an option; however, I am not familiar with She-Hulk comics so I am not sure if that makes sense stylistically.

Aside from those ideas you may have to go a new route as I am not sure where else they could pull a character from that would make sense.
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Mike Murdock
Golden Age


Joined: 08 Sep 2014
Posts: 1750

PostPosted: Wed Apr 04, 2018 6:25 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

The lack of supporting cast in general bothers me. There's very little development on that front.
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Daredevil24
Humanity's Fathom


Joined: 06 Apr 2011
Posts: 367

PostPosted: Wed Apr 04, 2018 10:14 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

macjr33 wrote:
Daredevil24 wrote:
And while I don't mind Matt not dating yet another new woman the relationship absence is clearly noticeable. Me personally would like a new take on Daredevil/Elektra but that's just me. This issue just wasn't what it should have been.


I completely agree with this and, in my opinion, is even more magnified with him not having a relationship for Foggy either. To me what separates Matt from say Batman, is that Matt very much wants to try and live the dual life of both Matt Murdock the lawyer and Daredevil. To that end, he very much values the relationships that he has with those that are important to him. When you think of the most impactful story arcs for Matt they are often built around the relationships he has with those around him like his relationship with his father, the death of Elektra and Karen, how he and Karen reconciled in Born Again, Daredevil: Yellow, his life falling apart during the Bendis/Brubaker run and it leading to his failed marriage, Foggy getting cancer, learning the truth of why his Mom left. These were so powerful because of the connection Matt has with others that are important to him and is rather unique to Matt in the comic world. I feel that aspect is missing from Soule's run as I certainly do not feel that connection with Sam.

Another aspect of it is that while I certainly detest people like Kevin Smith's false interpretation of Matt as a womanizer, as he is NOT Tony Stark. I do, however, think that Matt is a very suave and charismatic particularly with women, almost an antithesis of Spider-Man in that regard. I think Waid did a good job of showcasing that in a much more positive light then Smith did and that is something fun that I like seeing in the comics that further differentiates Matt.

As for who he should be dating, I am pretty open in the regard. A fresh look at Matt/Elektra could be nice though with all the history between them it may be a bit hard to pull off. Similarly, my dream would be for him to be with Natasha, which is also not going to happen.

Other existing characters I wouldn't mind seeing would be bringing back Echo as to me I am not sure I have ever seen Matt more genuinely happy with someone (outside of the last panel in Born Again with Karen) then he was when he was on the date with Maya. I think Jen Walters is an option; however, I am not familiar with She-Hulk comics so I am not sure if that makes sense stylistically.

Aside from those ideas you may have to go a new route as I am not sure where else they could pull a character from that would make sense.
Outside of Elektra my choices would be Dakota North & Echo. Soule seems fond of Echo but the problem is he tampered with their history so her presence and chemistry with the title character in the series has suffered. My choices from someone knew would be Jessica Drew. I wanted that since I saw them briefly interact during New Avengers, also since she's a mother of an infant I think it'd be interesting how Matt handled the relationship.

I don't have many nice things to say about Mark Waid but I will admit he wrote Matt more positive when it came on to his dealing with women. He made him a man who attracted women because he was a gentleman and a good listener rather than a horn dog.

I thought DG Chichester handled Matt & Karen nicely before Fall from Grace. I also like the Karl Kessel and Joe Kellys wrote their relationship. Though I don't like witty Matt I enjoyed him happy with Karen.

I do hate how Ed Brubaker dropped Natasha from the series and gave her to Bucky. Natasha & Matt were my definite couple. But with her affiliation with the Avengers and Bucky I don't expect to her play a large role in his series again, unless an older writer who understands how great their relationship was gets the green light to bring her in.

I still think no matter how much interesting stories came out after Karen's death it was a mistake to kill her.
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macjr33
Flying Blind


Joined: 22 Nov 2017
Posts: 97
Location: Pittsburgh, PA

PostPosted: Wed Apr 04, 2018 3:32 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Daredevil24 wrote:
Outside of Elektra my choices would be Dakota North & Echo. Soule seems fond of Echo but the problem is he tampered with their history so her presence and chemistry with the title character in the series has suffered. My choices from someone knew would be Jessica Drew. I wanted that since I saw them briefly interact during New Avengers, also since she's a mother of an infant I think it'd be interesting how Matt handled the relationship.


I never thought about Jessica Drew as my only exposure to the character was her appearance in Alias as I haven't read the New Avengers series. I think that could be really cool! Also, I love the idea of Matt being in a relationship where there is a child involved.

Daredevil24 wrote:
I do hate how Ed Brubaker dropped Natasha from the series and gave her to Bucky. Natasha & Matt were my definite couple. But with her affiliation with the Avengers and Bucky I don't expect to her play a large role in his series again, unless an older writer who understands how great their relationship was gets the green light to bring her in.


While I completely agree that I didn't like Natasha's absence from Brubaker's run, I can excuse it if part of the rationale was that Brubaker knew he wanted Matt to have an affair and didn't want it to be with Natasha, so instead Dakota served a similar role to what Natasha would have been in the run. If that is true, then I agree 100% as had Matt had the affair with Natasha it would have damaged their relationship in my eyes. And while I don't expect her to play a big role anytime soon, I do wish she dropped in on occasion, even if it is something as simple as Waid did when she made sure Milla was safe.

Daredevil24 wrote:
I still think no matter how much interesting stories came out after Karen's death it was a mistake to kill her.


I struggle with this because while I do believe that Karen was the love of Matt's life and that their relationship was complex and had a sense of realism, I also loved a lot of what came after Guardian Devil, particularly with Parts of a Hole and the Bendis/Brubaker run. I wonder how different those stories would have been had Karen not died. Her death also further cements Matt as tragic character that is easier to relate to because his failures have lasting consequences.
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Sunni
Flying Blind


Joined: 07 Jan 2017
Posts: 87

PostPosted: Thu Apr 05, 2018 3:34 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

macjr33 wrote:
To me what separates Matt from say Batman, is that Matt very much wants to try and live the dual life of both Matt Murdock the lawyer and Daredevil.

IMHO it depends on the interpretation. There are stories about Batman where he is the happy patriarch of his Bat Family who takes them out to dinner, and there’s takes on Daredevil like Charlie Cox’s:
Quote:
"He’s living a lie as Matt Murdock. And so one of the things I love about that superhero, DD is the authentic one."

I’m purely speculating, but maybe Soule shares Cox’s opinion considering that so far in Soule’s run Matt Murdock only exists as a legal tool to further Daredevil’s goals?

Mike Murdock wrote:
The lack of supporting cast in general bothers me. There's very little development on that front.

When it’s been 34 issues, that’s clearly intentional. It doesn’t bother me, but I totally understand why it’s not working for you and other readers. It is a bleaker depiction of Matt’s psyche.

macjr33 wrote:
I do, however, think that Matt is a very suave and charismatic particularly with women, almost an antithesis of Spider-Man in that regard.

Daredevil24 wrote:
He made him a man who attracted women because he was a gentleman and a good listener rather than a horn dog.

I agree that Matt is a ladies’ man, not a womanizer. He values women. Matt broke up with Kirsten because he knew something bad would happen to her eventually, so I think the next love interest should be a superheroine so he can relax a little. As for who, well, Elektra, Echo, and She-Hulk are available. Spider-Woman fans really like her with Porcupine, so I doubt that would work, and yes, Black Widow has been purposely moved away from his sphere, so that’s unlikely.

macjr33 wrote:
Her death also further cements Matt as tragic character that is easier to relate to because his failures have lasting consequences.

I like that aspect about Karen's death as well, but IMHO losing a different love interest could have had the same resonance for Matt as long as it was properly built beforehand and followed up on in the aftermath. I will say that current Marvel is emphasizing superheroes dating superheroes (Miles with Spider-Gwen, Peter with Mockingbird, Falcon with Misty, etc.), so if Karen was around, she’d be harder to incorporate in the book unless she decided to start fighting crime.
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Daredevil24
Humanity's Fathom


Joined: 06 Apr 2011
Posts: 367

PostPosted: Fri Apr 06, 2018 8:58 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I really wish Matt would run intout Yukio again now that she's Deathstrike. I know she's a Wolverine villain but Iron Fist recently ran into Sabretooth(the boolast where he debuted) again and it's been good despite his strong ties to Wolverine.
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Mike Murdock
Golden Age


Joined: 08 Sep 2014
Posts: 1750

PostPosted: Fri Apr 06, 2018 5:20 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

The problem is how much his history has been purged from the character's backstory.
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Matt Murdock's cooler twin brother

Not sure what to read next? Check out the Book Club for some ideas!

I'd give the Devil benefit of law, for my own safety's sake!
Thomas More - A Man for All Seasons
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