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MarcWagz
Flying Blind
Joined: 16 Jan 2008
Posts: 83
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 Posted: Wed Jan 16, 2008 5:53 pm Post subject: A new Villain for DareDevil! |
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I just thought about something...
I read through Daredevil V2 1-94 a little bit ago, and throughout it all, Daredevil doesn't get one new villain!
Whats this new obsession with 'revisiting old villains' now, why can't they just make a new one? The writers charachter creation brains need to take an imaginative turn, I know that Bullseye used to be no big deal, but if they make a new villain, there is a chance for greatness?
Anyone have any ideas? |
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jumonji
Guardian Devil
Joined: 23 Sep 2007
Posts: 636
Location: Too close to the Arctic circle
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| Posted: Wed Jan 16, 2008 6:21 pm Post subject: |
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Welcome to the board! 
About new villains, I wonder if this might have something to do with writers having to relinquish the rights to any characters they create and Marvel maybe having a strict policy on new villains. I don't know, but I suspect there might be factors like that involved.
However, I agree that there should be room for new villains, even though I think digging up old ones is not a bad idea if writers are able to revamp them and make them feel new again. I would imagine that Brubaker might have one or two new ones in store for us though, especially with the Kingpin being out of the picture (for the time being). If he comes up with some new baddies, I would prefer that they don't have a ton of superpowers or magic abilities. A psychotic genius with a hypersonic device would be scary enough. 
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MarcWagz
Flying Blind
Joined: 16 Jan 2008
Posts: 83
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| Posted: Wed Jan 16, 2008 6:44 pm Post subject: |
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i think he should make a villain that is like a Daredevil clone...
Sort of what David Mack was trying to do with Echo, just not bad...
(not that david macks work was bad in any regard)
Just some kind of villain with martial arts skills equal to daredevils, but with his own unique 'quirk' that can be combated by daredevils radar...
Sort of like Venom is to spiderman...
It doesnt really matter what his quirk would be, it could be something incredibly powerful or it could be really pathetic, but... then again pathetic usually isnt good.
If I was going to make a charachter I would make one to return DD to his stealth days, some kind of Ninja, hell maybe even a rogue hand Ninja, with some kind of special cloaking technology maybe?
Anyways~ |
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Blind Alley
Tree of Knowledge
Joined: 06 Nov 2004
Posts: 292
Location: Lyon, France
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| Posted: Wed Jan 16, 2008 7:18 pm Post subject: |
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| MarcWagz wrote: | i think he should make a villain that is like a Daredevil clone...
(...)
Sort of like Venom is to spiderman...
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There was the Hellspawn who was kinda "negative double" of DD.
Like Venom can't be detected by the SPider sense, Hellspawn couldn't be "seen" by DD's radar.
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Gloria
Redemption
Joined: 28 Apr 2007
Posts: 711
Location: Suburbia around Barcelona
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| Posted: Thu Jan 17, 2008 2:03 am Post subject: |
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| MarcWagz wrote: | | i think he should make a villain that is like a Daredevil clone... |
AAARGH! No! not clones!
 Sorry I just have this trauma about the "maximum clonage" stories at Spidey. As Christine has pointed, this has been done already, and I admit that Hellspawn never tickled me. And let's not forget Mike Murdock
Even though the idea of an "evil alter ego" is interesting: Mr. Fear now is sort of a Murdock in negative, and Elektra also was like a sister gone awry.
Still, Old or New, the important thing is that a villain is properly written... I mean Brubaker could have Forbush Man fighting DD and I bet it would be an interesting story
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Devuélveme el rosario de mi madre y quédate con todo lo demás
"Para la cuesta arriba quiero mi burro, que la cuesta abajo yo me la subo" |
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The Overlord
Paradiso
Joined: 22 Aug 2004
Posts: 1095
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| Posted: Thu Jan 17, 2008 10:57 am Post subject: |
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| MarcWagz wrote: | i think he should make a villain that is like a Daredevil clone...
Sort of what David Mack was trying to do with Echo, just not bad...
(not that david macks work was bad in any regard)
Just some kind of villain with martial arts skills equal to daredevils, but with his own unique 'quirk' that can be combated by daredevils radar...
Sort of like Venom is to spiderman...
It doesnt really matter what his quirk would be, it could be something incredibly powerful or it could be really pathetic, but... then again pathetic usually isnt good.
If I was going to make a charachter I would make one to return DD to his stealth days, some kind of Ninja, hell maybe even a rogue hand Ninja, with some kind of special cloaking technology maybe?
Anyways~ |
The problem is that its very hard to create new interesting villains nowadays, because after 40 years of modern comics, a lot of the villain ideas were already taken. For example if you try to make a villain with ice powers, the character will seem bland because there are already several villains with that power, unless there is something that makes him different. I think Echo is just the poor man's Taskmaster for example.
Like the evil version of DD, I'm pretty sure that DD has fought several villains who have fighting skills that are equal or better than his (Elektra for example) so that's not really new. There are a ton of ninja villains in comics, so they are pretty generic at this point.
The quirk that makes them this character (that you are purposing) differnet, is supremely important, not an after thought. DD is more than just a ninja, its his super senses that make him differnet and give him an advantage over his enemies. So a true anti DD villain either needs either a way to
counter DD's senses or needs super senses of his/her own. plus there is more too a villain then powers, what is this villain's motive, what's his personality, does he have a grudge against DD or a more generalized goal?
Also Bendis did create new villains: Bont, the Yakuza guys, Sammy Silke, most of them just died at the end of the story.
That's why bru is revamping old villains, a lot of the prep work is already done, the character is established. bendis made Purple Man into a great character and he hasn't been used in DD for 20 years. |
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MarcWagz
Flying Blind
Joined: 16 Jan 2008
Posts: 83
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| Posted: Thu Jan 17, 2008 1:05 pm Post subject: |
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I think it would be cool for DD to fight an invisible ninja!
Anyways, I understand all that too, Just seems to me that old villains are being revitilized to turn into supervillains
hmm, why not just make one
anyways~ |
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The Overlord
Paradiso
Joined: 22 Aug 2004
Posts: 1095
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| Posted: Thu Jan 17, 2008 2:11 pm Post subject: |
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| MarcWagz wrote: | I think it would be cool for DD to fight an invisible ninja!
Anyways, I understand all that too, Just seems to me that old villains are being revitilized to turn into supervillains
hmm, why not just make one
anyways~ |
Like I said its easier said than done. Creating new villains is not easy, its kinda like going up to a scentist and say make a new invention. Also like i said there have many decent DD villains that haven't been used in the title in years.
Plus there is problem that could happen when creating a new villain, they could just become flash in the pan villains only used by their creator, then forgotten.
Now are we talking about a ninja who is invisible in the traditional or invisible to DD's super sense. A foe that can only be detected by the naked eye, could be intereting, because it be the kind of foe DD could beat if he could see, which would be ironic.
Though the ninja thing is overplayed in the DD title, there have been many villains over DD's career that have been ninjas.
Anyway if Bru is truly interested in revamping DD's rogues gallery I think the best route is to do what Johns did with flash's rogues gallery: revamp old villains and create new |
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David Mack
Flying Blind
Joined: 08 Dec 2006
Posts: 3
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| Posted: Fri Jan 18, 2008 10:00 pm Post subject: |
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I just saw a link to this on davidmackguide.com.
I should add that Echo was created specifically as a new villain for Daredevil. When I was asked to write Daredevil that was Joe Quesada's request to me that I create a brand new character in that story (issues 9-15), that was a new addition to DD's rogues gallery.
Though my favorite part of that story turned out to be the origin of the Kingpin, it did bring a brand new character in the Marvel U which it turns out is now used in the Avengers.
And the idea behind here was as a kind of rogue with abilities complimentary but different to Daredevil's own.
| MarcWagz wrote: | i think he should make a villain that is like a Daredevil clone...
Sort of what David Mack was trying to do with Echo, just not bad...
(not that david macks work was bad in any regard)
Just some kind of villain with martial arts skills equal to daredevils, but with his own unique 'quirk' that can be combated by daredevils radar...
Sort of like Venom is to spiderman...
It doesnt really matter what his quirk would be, it could be something incredibly powerful or it could be really pathetic, but... then again pathetic usually isnt good.
If I was going to make a charachter I would make one to return DD to his stealth days, some kind of Ninja, hell maybe even a rogue hand Ninja, with some kind of special cloaking technology maybe?
Anyways~ |
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Dimetre
Underboss
Joined: 16 Feb 2006
Posts: 1366
Location: Toronto
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| Posted: Sat Jan 19, 2008 3:03 am Post subject: |
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| David Mack wrote: | I just saw a link to this on davidmackguide.com.
I should add that Echo was created specifically as a new villain for Daredevil. When I was asked to write Daredevil that was Joe Quesada's request to me that I create a brand new character in that story (issues 9-15), that was a new addition to DD's rogues gallery.
Though my favorite part of that story turned out to be the origin of the Kingpin, it did bring a brand new character in the Marvel U which it turns out is now used in the Avengers.
And the idea behind here was as a kind of rogue with abilities complimentary but different to Daredevil's own. |
I remember when I began reading Parts of a Hole, I got the sense that Echo was going to be a great new villain, who was able to go toe to toe with Daredevil. That's how I approached the story and that's how Marvel seemed to pitch it. Really, though, she's a victim of the Kingpin's deception, and because of that a reader would correctly assume that in Echo's future appearances she would know longer be a villain, but a love interest and an ally. The Kingpin was the real antagonist in that story, but I really did enjoy Echo's battles with Daredevil in that story. They were evenly matched, and they approached the fights with real intelligence.
That was over 90 issues ago. It would be great to see Brubaker create a new villain. |
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David Mack
Flying Blind
Joined: 08 Dec 2006
Posts: 3
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| Posted: Sat Jan 19, 2008 7:13 am Post subject: |
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Thanks pal.
That was a fun story to write and it was a joy to see Quesada's finished art pages of the script.
And it turned out that writing the Kingpin history was my favorite part and probably the most personal part of the story for me.
I never would have imagined Bendis would be using Echo in the Avengers years later.
I'm drawing New Avengers #39 right now which includes Echo and DD and is a fun return to those characters and as well as new characters I've never written or drawn before like Hawkeye.
Also, it is a fun issue in that I'm pencilling and inking it in a new style and enjoying wallowing in the Marvel-ness of it.
By the way, I agree with you about the necesity of new characters, especially villains. If I was writing DD (or perhaps if I return to it) I'd create a brand new villain.
| Dimetre wrote: | | David Mack wrote: | I just saw a link to this on davidmackguide.com.
I should add that Echo was created specifically as a new villain for Daredevil. When I was asked to write Daredevil that was Joe Quesada's request to me that I create a brand new character in that story (issues 9-15), that was a new addition to DD's rogues gallery.
Though my favorite part of that story turned out to be the origin of the Kingpin, it did bring a brand new character in the Marvel U which it turns out is now used in the Avengers.
And the idea behind here was as a kind of rogue with abilities complimentary but different to Daredevil's own. |
I remember when I began reading Parts of a Hole, I got the sense that Echo was going to be a great new villain, who was able to go toe to toe with Daredevil. That's how I approached the story and that's how Marvel seemed to pitch it. Really, though, she's a victim of the Kingpin's deception, and because of that a reader would correctly assume that in Echo's future appearances she would know longer be a villain, but a love interest and an ally. The Kingpin was the real antagonist in that story, but I really did enjoy Echo's battles with Daredevil in that story. They were evenly matched, and they approached the fights with real intelligence.
That was over 90 issues ago. It would be great to see Brubaker create a new villain. |
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The Overlord
Paradiso
Joined: 22 Aug 2004
Posts: 1095
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| Posted: Sun Jan 20, 2008 12:43 am Post subject: |
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| Dimetre wrote: |
That was over 90 issues ago. It would be great to see Brubaker create a new villain. |
Still there is nothing wrong with what Bru is doing now, taking old forgotten villains and revamping them. There plenty of good DD villains that easily be threats if the writers treat them in a more serious manner. |
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MarcWagz
Flying Blind
Joined: 16 Jan 2008
Posts: 83
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| Posted: Sun Jan 20, 2008 3:29 pm Post subject: |
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am I to assume that is actually the writer there?
If so...
Anyways 90 issues is a long time, especially since The kingpin and bullseye have been used over 4 arcs in that period |
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