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DD Book Club: Lowlife
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Mike Murdock
Lowlife


Joined: 08 Sep 2014
Posts: 1415

PostPosted: Sun Jan 22, 2017 8:02 pm    Post subject: DD Book Club: Lowlife Reply with quote

I wasn't sure which story we wanted to do next, so I'll continue with Bendis for now.

Daredevil Vol. 2 # 41 - Lowlife Part 1



Quote:
Only 25 cents! The movie is coming, and we want retailers to introduce one of the best books published today to a new wave of readers! That's why this issue -- which kicks off the next stunning DD storyline – will only cost a quarter! And best of all, "Lowlife" continues in only two weeks!


Well, that's one way to do a solicit, I guess...

Due 1/28
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Mike Murdock
Lowlife


Joined: 08 Sep 2014
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PostPosted: Mon Jan 23, 2017 9:37 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I guess I get to be first this week.

If you want textbook Bendis speak, this opening page is exactly that. But it establishes Milla as a character who is blind, works in Hell's Kitchen, and helps the poor by finding them housing. Then Milla almost gets hit by a bus in a way that's clearly similar to Daredevil's origin story. Still, it's a nice scene of Matt being commanding and heroic. For the intro to their relationship, I think it at least makes a splash.

The scene with Wilbur Day has some of the best and worst dialogue. I think it's genuinely funny with Matt deadpanning "have we met?" I loved Day quitting being Stilt-Man. It sets up some of the themes going forward with the idea of everyone being afraid of Daredevil and Matt basically being like the Kingpin. But the long-winded dialogue (that Bendis does whenever he wants to lay down the mantra of the story) can be quite awkward to read. Say what you will about the repetition he does earlier (back and forth), but that at least has a fun rhythm to it. However, I do think Bendis at least cleverly hides the themes a bit. Day feels like he's losing his mind and the important dialogue in the short term is that the Owl is coming back.

If it seems I'm focusing on the dialogue, that's because it's the highlight. There's a double page splash with two mini-frames inside it that, unfortunately, Maleev draws as clear as mud. I guess he killed the messenger and it's supposed to make us think he's strong and unhinged, but it took me several reads to get what was going on. Aside from that, there isn't much. The rescue scene of Milla earlier is fine, but not overly dynamic. Really, the highlight art-wise is Matt's smug look during the Stilt-Man scene, which I do think actually contribute to the dialogue in the way comic books should work.

So Three and a Half Stars. I think the issue does two things right. One, the introduction of Milla is memorable. To have someone replace Karen, that person has to sweep Matt off his feet (or vice-versa). And I like the scene with Stilt-Man.
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Dimetre
Parts of a Hole


Joined: 16 Feb 2006
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PostPosted: Tue Jan 24, 2017 4:05 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

After a three-issue break Alex Maleev is back, and I can't say I'm excited.

There are some pretty panels. I like the montage of Daredevil busting up different places looking for a lead on the Owl. The playing cards looked great, along with the film strip. Otherwise, his figures are just so stiff, and his backgrounds are all the same. The panel of Daredevil's boot smacking a guy in the chin looks like a still photograph of a guy posing with his chin up and a mannequin leg with a red boot placed in position. The panel with that guy getting smacked in the head with the billy club? That looks even more posed. There is no motion. Maleev just can't draw action.

The worst for me is the two-page spread of the Owl having a fit. I remember, years ago when this issue first came out, staring at that two-page spread, trying to figure out what the hell is going on. I guess he sliced the throat of the guy who came in to tell him about Daredevil, even though I forgot that guy was there. I'm completely confused about that image of the Owl with his hand in front of his throat. I don't know who the people behind Anad are. We never saw them before.

This issue cost 25 cents. A lot of people gave this issue a shot. I think this issue was put out when the Affleck movie was released. I can't say that this issue was that good of a jumping on point. Sure, this is the first appearance of Milla Donovan, but she didn't go on to mean that much to me. There is a lot of exposition in this issue, even though there was also a recap page. The scene with Wilbur Day is all exposition. I can't imagine that the new readers this issue attracted found it very enthralling.

Even though I think the scene in which Daredevil rescues Milla could have been done just as well with fewer pages, it is still well done, although "I'm sorry for the jarring break in your day" is something human beings don't say.

I think the worst scene in this issue is between Matt and Day. It's just talking heads, countless word balloons and drab backgrounds. It's tiring to look at and to read. And the worst of it is -- these are all things we could be shown rather that told about! Why not show us Vanessa setting up these territories? You could have Day's dialogue on top of those images! Any other comic book artist would have done that. Show the Owl storming other villain's territories. It's as if Bendis and Maleev are new to this comic book industry.

Another thing: Day is a scientist. He doesn't talk like one. He talks like any other stooge from the streets. He's also a short man, but I didn't get any sense of that from Maleev's drawings. He looks short in comparison to Melvin Potter, but Melvin has always been a big guy. Day's character is way off in every sense of the word.

I know that people don't care about Stilt Man. He's widely regarded as a joke these days. But I'm tired of not one writer trying to do something cool with him. Why not surprise your audience by making Stilt Man truly dangerous? It would catch all of us off guard. Bendis is the worst for this. He has Stilt Man quit altogether, and wait until you see what he does with other villains.

Matt continues to act stupid. He's under media scrutiny, yet he hires Melvin Potter as a bodyguard. I know he likes Melvin and feels responsibility for him, but he also dissolved his dealings with Ben Urich. If he's aware of the danger of dealing with Ben, how can he not be aware of the danger of dealing with people like Melvin? It also pisses me off how he shows no regard for anything Foggy says.

The already mentioned montage of Daredevil roughing people up takes up two pages. Then we go to Owl's lair, then we have a flashback of Daredevil roughing people up, and it takes up three pages. We don't need all that! I think we could have had one page of montage, go right to Daredevil attacking the Owl's men (in two pages max!) and then go to the Owl. I just don't understand Bendis' storytelling choices. What is gained by going from montage to Owl to a flashback that accomplishes the same thing the montage did?

Ugh. Bendis and Maleev frustrate me. As a team they were praised out the yin yang every issue, and I had no idea why.

I give this issue a two and a half out of five. I thought the opening scene was fine, and I think the idea of Owl taking over the Kingpin's old territories had potential. The execution of that idea is horrible. We are not shown any of it. We just have characters telling us that it happened. Any other writer would have known to do that differently.
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Mike Murdock
Lowlife


Joined: 08 Sep 2014
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PostPosted: Tue Jan 24, 2017 5:45 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Honestly, I don't think I realized how bland Maleev actually is until I re-read the previous arc with someone else. It felt like such a breath of fresh air. It's surprising because I remember liking Maleev, but it doesn't stand up.
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The Overlord
Paradiso


Joined: 22 Aug 2004
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PostPosted: Tue Jan 24, 2017 11:11 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Dimetre wrote:
After a three-issue break Alex Maleev is back, and I can't say I'm excited.

There are some pretty panels. I like the montage of Daredevil busting up different places looking for a lead on the Owl. The playing cards looked great, along with the film strip. Otherwise, his figures are just so stiff, and his backgrounds are all the same. The panel of Daredevil's boot smacking a guy in the chin looks like a still photograph of a guy posing with his chin up and a mannequin leg with a red boot placed in position. The panel with that guy getting smacked in the head with the billy club? That looks even more posed. There is no motion. Maleev just can't draw action.

The worst for me is the two-page spread of the Owl having a fit. I remember, years ago when this issue first came out, staring at that two-page spread, trying to figure out what the hell is going on. I guess he sliced the throat of the guy who came in to tell him about Daredevil, even though I forgot that guy was there. I'm completely confused about that image of the Owl with his hand in front of his throat. I don't know who the people behind Anad are. We never saw them before.

This issue cost 25 cents. A lot of people gave this issue a shot. I think this issue was put out when the Affleck movie was released. I can't say that this issue was that good of a jumping on point. Sure, this is the first appearance of Milla Donovan, but she didn't go on to mean that much to me. There is a lot of exposition in this issue, even though there was also a recap page. The scene with Wilbur Day is all exposition. I can't imagine that the new readers this issue attracted found it very enthralling.

Even though I think the scene in which Daredevil rescues Milla could have been done just as well with fewer pages, it is still well done, although "I'm sorry for the jarring break in your day" is something human beings don't say.

I think the worst scene in this issue is between Matt and Day. It's just talking heads, countless word balloons and drab backgrounds. It's tiring to look at and to read. And the worst of it is -- these are all things we could be shown rather that told about! Why not show us Vanessa setting up these territories? You could have Day's dialogue on top of those images! Any other comic book artist would have done that. Show the Owl storming other villain's territories. It's as if Bendis and Maleev are new to this comic book industry.

Another thing: Day is a scientist. He doesn't talk like one. He talks like any other stooge from the streets. He's also a short man, but I didn't get any sense of that from Maleev's drawings. He looks short in comparison to Melvin Potter, but Melvin has always been a big guy. Day's character is way off in every sense of the word.

I know that people don't care about Stilt Man. He's widely regarded as a joke these days. But I'm tired of not one writer trying to do something cool with him. Why not surprise your audience by making Stilt Man truly dangerous? It would catch all of us off guard. Bendis is the worst for this. He has Stilt Man quit altogether, and wait until you see what he does with other villains.

Matt continues to act stupid. He's under media scrutiny, yet he hires Melvin Potter as a bodyguard. I know he likes Melvin and feels responsibility for him, but he also dissolved his dealings with Ben Urich. If he's aware of the danger of dealing with Ben, how can he not be aware of the danger of dealing with people like Melvin? It also pisses me off how he shows no regard for anything Foggy says.

The already mentioned montage of Daredevil roughing people up takes up two pages. Then we go to Owl's lair, then we have a flashback of Daredevil roughing people up, and it takes up three pages. We don't need all that! I think we could have had one page of montage, go right to Daredevil attacking the Owl's men (in two pages max!) and then go to the Owl. I just don't understand Bendis' storytelling choices. What is gained by going from montage to Owl to a flashback that accomplishes the same thing the montage did?

Ugh. Bendis and Maleev frustrate me. As a team they were praised out the yin yang every issue, and I had no idea why.

I give this issue a two and a half out of five. I thought the opening scene was fine, and I think the idea of Owl taking over the Kingpin's old territories had potential. The execution of that idea is horrible. We are not shown any of it. We just have characters telling us that it happened. Any other writer would have known to do that differently.


To be fair, Miller was likely the first writer to treat Stilt-Man like a joke, that issue had Stilt-Man knocked out by Turk, so I am not surprised Bendis did the same thing. The guy does not have a good gimmick, the Beetle is another armored villain who was kinda a loser, has way better designed armor. Stilt-Man would be better working for the fire department then being a criminal. It was interesting that Stilt-Man quit, its a shame he died a couple of years later and no one has ever bothered to bring Wilbur Day back. There are 3 other Stilt-Man characters running around now and there was a weird terrorist group that worshiped Stilt-Man in an Iron Man story, I guess he has a legacy.

There are things I like about this issue that have not been mentioned, even though its not well drawn, I like Owl going psycho and killing one of his own guy's for no reason. I also like
DD burning the money Owl's goons collected that night.

I kinda liked DD and Milla's first meeting, it was interesting. I like that he helped with her shoulder.

I always liked the idea of Owl being Kingpin's main rival. Miller tried to created a rival for Kingpin called Injun Joe, but that guy never worked, he was bland, barely appeared, had no presence and his name is a racial slur.

Owl has been with DD since near the beginning, he was Stan Lee's first attempt to a arch enemy for DD and even though he didn't work out in that role, he can still play a role in DD's modern world. He has more personality and presence then Injun Joe does.

I think my ideal version of Owl is he is Kingpin wannnabe, who is not as smart as Kingpin, but isn't stupid either, he is dangerous because he is reckless and unstable. Even a more light hearted comic like Superior Foes presented Owl as a psycho who feeds his men to rats if they fail him, even Fisk would find that needlessly sadistic. I think someone like Owl could make Fisk seem like a stabilizing force by comparison. I also like some of Kingpin's former underlings

The conversation about DVDs made laugh unintentionally because it dates this issue, if Bendis wrote it today, they would be talking about Netflix.

Anyway I will give this issue 3 stars.
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Mike Murdock
Lowlife


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PostPosted: Wed Jan 25, 2017 7:34 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I think the Owl is the first of a long line of crime bosses as DD villains. It's clear that the writers knew that was the best idea, but they couldn't make it work. When they brought in Kingpin, it finally did. That being said, while the unstable personality seems to be the one that stuck to make him stand out, Leland Owlsley was a successful accountant, which doesn't seem to fit in with an impatient, unstable person).
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The Overlord
Paradiso


Joined: 22 Aug 2004
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PostPosted: Wed Jan 25, 2017 1:05 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Mike Murdock wrote:
I think the Owl is the first of a long line of crime bosses as DD villains. It's clear that the writers knew that was the best idea, but they couldn't make it work. When they brought in Kingpin, it finally did. That being said, while the unstable personality seems to be the one that stuck to make him stand out, Leland Owlsley was a successful accountant, which doesn't seem to fit in with an impatient, unstable person).


There is a reason for his unstable personality though, there was an arc in the early 90s (just after Last Rites) that said Owl was taking a serum that allowed him to fly and the serum was affecting his mind and body. He needed mental braces to walk and googles to see (he could also turn his head at a 180 angle), he starting living in the sewers , eating rats and killing random people because he thought he was a super predator who had to hunt weaker prey.

That arc even had Owl unhappy about losing his career on Wall Street and being over shadowed by Fisk as a crime boss. This story treated sympathetically, but future stories take the sympathy away and make him more psycho. I think Waid toned that a bit, but even he had Owl hide in trees and kill one of his guys.

Later Owl's body seemed to have recovered, but his mind is still affected. He still eats rats, he still kills people who no good reason, only now the sympathy is gone and Owl is just a psycho crime boss.

Really Owl was kinda of a nothing character before this revamp from the early 90s (Nocenti wrote him as an international throw back to silly Silver Age villains) and the revamp has stuck and it makes Owl more relevant in a post
Miller Daredevil world, both in terms of being more unique and being a better foil to both DD and Fisk.

So Bendis is just continuing what previous writers have done with Owl.
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Mike Murdock
Lowlife


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PostPosted: Sun Jan 29, 2017 9:28 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Daredevil Vol. 2 # 42 - Lowlife Part 2



Quote:
2 issues this month! The next shocking story continues here with part 2 of "Lowlife!"


Due 2/4
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Dimetre
Parts of a Hole


Joined: 16 Feb 2006
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PostPosted: Sun Jan 29, 2017 7:40 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

This is a frustrating issue for me.

First off, the cover is just the typical generic Daredevil artwork Alex Maleev has laying around. It's pretty, but it has nothing to do with the contents inside.

The scenes with Milla are well done. I seem to be enjoying Milla more this time around than I did when I first read these issues. Lori is kind of annoying, but Milla is kind of cool.

On the other hand, the scene in the back of the limo is unjustifiable. Four pages of chatter! Four! None of this chatter is pertinent to the plot at all! And there are errors! It seems that Kelly Lamy is no better an editor than Stuart Moore was. The dealer introduces a drug called MGN, and on the next page it's explained to be Mutant Growth Hormone, which should be MGH. Any proofreader would have caught this. The girl in the bikini seems to have a solid line dividing her face in two, while the men don't. I couldn't figure out why. The shadows on the men's faces aren't separated by solid lines.

Then Daredevil turns over a car with at least three people and an engine inside. Why didn't Lamy talk to Bendis and Maleev and say, "Um, no." I don't know how this happened. This is Bendis' twentieth issue of Daredevil. (I'm not even including Ninja.) How could he think that Daredevil is capable of lifting up a car and turning it onto its side? This doesn't seem to be a situation where he's having a surge of adrenaline. Yes, he seems pissed off, but I don't think anything is catching him by surprise. Everyone involved in the publication of this issue should know that this isn't right.

I also hate the way Maleev draws Daredevil when he's gritting his teeth. It looks like he's getting ready to spit.

Anad takes up an entire page to tell a joke that is in no way worth taking up an entire page.

Here is another thing that pisses me off about the Bendis era: The villains aren't formidable threats. Anad clearly doesn't take the Owl seriously, so neither do we. I'm reading this, and I find Anad annoying, and I find the Owl to be pathetic. You could even argue that the Owl isn't the antagonist of this arc. Anad is, and he can't compete with Daredevil. He tries, but Daredevil quickly catches wind of his plan.

And I think that this is the first time in Bendis' run where a villain calls Daredevil "Murdock" when he's in the costume. I didn't like that at all, and Matt would take less and less offence to that as Volume 2 wore on.

The rest of the issue, with Rosenthal at his pool and Milla arriving at Nelson and Murdock, is well-handled. Actually, those scenes are very well done.

However, the decompression this issue is amongst the worst I've seen from Bendis and Maleev. After "Trial of the Century," which moved along at a good clip, this pacing is interminable. I have to wonder how much of that is due to Maleev. I've already complained about the drug deal and Anad's joke, but the pages in Owl's lair before Matt arrives could have been trimmed rather easily. I think the first two issues of "Lowlife" could have taken up two-thirds of a typical comic book issue.

I also am well-aware that I have been given no reason to care about anything the Owl and Anad are hatching, and I'm pretty sure that's supposed to be the main plot of "Lowlife." So far I'm finding the beginning of Matt and Milla's romance more interesting, and that seems to be the B-plot. This is a big problem, because "Lowlife" has three issues to go.

As good as the scenes with Milla and Rosenthal are, I have to give this issue a failing grade. The flipping of the car is inexcusable, along with the failure to proofread and the awful decompression. Two out of five.


Last edited by Dimetre on Mon Jan 30, 2017 5:28 pm; edited 1 time in total
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The Overlord
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PostPosted: Sun Jan 29, 2017 9:34 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I am going to give this some higher praise then some of the more recent Bendis issues, unlike Out, this arc has a more coherent plot, with a love interest, a central villain and a few developments.

I kinda liked Milla in this issue, its kinda cute that she wants to visit Matt after DD saved her life.

In this issue, we see more of Owl's operation, selling a drug that gives people super powers. Now Daredevil flipping over a limo is one of those moments that seems cool at first, but doesn't really make sense, I don't think DD is that strong. I do like DD telling the druggies to go home and change their lives or spend more time with their family.

I liked some of the dialogue in this issue, especially when one of Owl's drug dealers tries to convince people to try his wears by saying reports about the negative effects of this drug are CNN trying to peddle fake news.

I also kinda liked Owl's lawyer trying to tell a joke and Owl just taking offense. The lawyer's joke went on too long, but I like the idea of trying to make small talk and office banter with a psycho super villain. I also like the lawyer trying to give Owl advice to be more Kingpin like, which is hard to do, because Owl's first impulse is to try and rip Daredevil's head off. I think nowadays Owl tries and fails being a suave crime boss due to his violent temper, but still can want to be more presentable sometimes, depending on his mood.

Anyway DD busts in and tries to rattle Owl, Owl mainly stays quite and Owl mostly stays silent, due to a combination of surprise and his lawyer's advice. Legally DD can't do any do anything to the Owl at the moment, but rattling his cage could bring up his impulsive side.

The rest of the issue deals some more of the media fall out from Out.

The real money shot for this issue, is Kingpin killing the owner of the Daily Globe and leaving his head in his pool. It hints at the return of DD'd arch enemy and shows that he is still dangerous.

This issue gets 3.5 stars, this is arc is better then Out.

Dimetre wrote:
This is a frustrating issue for me.

First off, the cover is just the typical generic Daredevil artwork Alex Maleev has lying around. It's pretty, but it has nothing to do with the contents inside.

The scenes with Milla are well done. I seem to be enjoying Milla more this time around than I did when I first read these issues. Lori is kind of annoying, but Milla is kind of cool.

On the other hand, the scene in the back of the limo is unjustifiable. Four pages of chatter! Four! None of this chatter is pertinent to the plot at all! And there are errors! It seems that Kelly Lamy is no better an editor than Stuart Moore was. The dealer introduces a drug called MGN, and on the next page it's explained to be Mutant Growth Hormone, which should be MGH. Any proofreader would have caught this. The girl in the bikini seems to have a solid line dividing her face in two, while the men don't. I couldn't figure out why. The shadows on the men's faces aren't separated by solid lines.

Then Daredevil turns over a car with at least three people and an engine inside. Why didn't Lamy talk to Bendis and Maleev and say, "Um, no." I don't know how this happened. This is Bendis' twentieth issue of Daredevil. (I'm not even including Ninja.) How could he think that Daredevil is capable of lifting up a car and turning it onto its side? This doesn't seem to be a situation where he's having a surge of adrenaline. Yes, he seems pissed off, but I don't think anything is catching him by surprise. Everyone involved in the publication of this issue should know that this isn't right.

I also hate the way Maleev draws Daredevil when he's gritting his teeth. It looks like he's getting ready to spit.

Anad takes up an entire page to tell a joke that is in no way worth taking up an entire page.

Here is another thing that pisses me off about the Bendis era: The villains aren't formidable threats. Anad clearly doesn't take the Owl seriously, so neither do we. I'm reading this, and I find Anad annoying, and I find the Owl to be pathetic. You could even argue that the Owl isn't the antagonist of this arc. Anad is, and he can't compete with Daredevil. He tries, but Daredevil quickly catches wind of his plan.

And I think that this is the first time in Bendis' run where a villain calls Daredevil "Murdock" when he's in the costume. I didn't like that at all, and Matt would take less and less offence to that as Volume 2 wore on.

The rest of the issue, with Rosenthal at his pool and Milla arriving at Nelson and Murdock are well-handled. Actually, they're very well done.

However, the decompression this issue is amongst the worst I've seen from Bendis and Maleev. After "Trial of the Century," which moved along at a good clip, this pacing is interminable. I have to wonder how much of that is due to Maleev. I've already complained about the drug deal and Anad's joke, but the pages in Owl's lair before Matt arrives could have been trimmed rather easily. I think the first two issues of "Lowlife" could have taken up two-thirds of a typical comic book issue.

I also am well-aware that I have been given no reason to care about anything the Owl and Anad are hatching, and I'm pretty sure that's supposed to be the main plot of "Lowlife." So far I'm finding the beginning of Matt and Milla's romance more interesting, and that seems to be the B-plot. This is a big problem, because "Lowlife" has three issues to go.

As good as the scenes with Milla and Rosenthal are, I have to give this issue a failing grade. The flipping of the care is inexcusable, along with the failure to proofread and the awful decompression. Two out of five.


Do you think Owl was better handled by Waid and Brubaker?
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Dimetre
Parts of a Hole


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PostPosted: Mon Jan 30, 2017 5:44 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

The Overlord wrote:
Do you think Owl was better handled by Waid and Brubaker?

Not really. Under Brubaker, the Owl was a slightly more bloodthirsty and sloppy version of the Kingpin. He was clearly a secondary villain and easily manipulated.

I think when the Owl first appeared in Waid's run, he showed enormous potential to be a fearsome villain, but that potential was never realized. It also didn't help that the climax of the Owl story coincided with Matt's decision to wear a red three-piece suit. **shudder**

I don't know if there has ever been a truly great Owl story. I think his potential to develop into something great was hampered by Miller's decision to import the Kingpin into Daredevil's world. It's funny, because, the Owl pre-dates the Kingpin, but Fisk has completely usurped the Owl's modus operandi.

I guess if I had to pick a depiction of the Owl, perhaps the one in Daredevil/Spider-Man. He was pretty creepy there. On the other hand, he was a somewhat sympathetic character in a team-up with the Vulture against Daredevil and Spider-Man (Amazing Spider-Man #396, Spectacular Spider-Man #219). I think no single writer has defined his character, and that's a big problem.
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Mike Murdock
Lowlife


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PostPosted: Mon Jan 30, 2017 8:19 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

First off, I like the cover, although I like it better in the image I posted than in my collected edition (the posted version is red-tinted throughout, which adds a nice effect to it). The issue starts with a talkey Milla scene, which I'm fine with because that story needs to continue and giving her some time before we meet Matt is a good thing (even if it categorically fails the Bechdel Test). Then we move to a talkey scene with MGH. I'm cool with MGH existing and as an illegal street drug, but I don't quite get how it gets marketed as a party drug. That never really made sense to me. But it leads to two panels of Daredevil doing something weird with his teeth, so there's that.

I do like the confrontation with the Owl. It's an ultimately fruitless scene and it doesn't do the Owl any favors to essentially be led around by his nose. But it plays the long-game. Matt isn't powerless to stop the Owl because the Owl is that good, he's powerless because he's trapped in a box and everything he does makes his lawsuit less tenable. I do like that tension.

Finally, there's the final scene with the newspaper guy. The blues in the scene are beautiful, I have to give credit for that. Judging on its own, it's a little long, but the slow burn mixed with silence works very well. Regardless, slow burn mixed with silence feels like it sums up this issue quite well where not a lot of things happen. Three and a Half Stars.

Commenting on everyone's comments so far:

Dimetre, I agree with almost everything you wrote. I'll defend the joke, though, because I laughed. I also think calling Daredevil "Murdock" makes a lot of sense in the desire to create a clausterphobic feeling that he's trapped by his identity being revealed.

The Overlord, I agree that the Kingpin shot is probably the best of the issue.

Regarding Waid's handling of the Owl, he always came off as kind of tame, which fits Waid's DD a bit more so that's OK. I enjoyed when he swooped down and ate that rat, though.
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The Overlord
Paradiso


Joined: 22 Aug 2004
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PostPosted: Mon Jan 30, 2017 11:43 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Dimetre wrote:
The Overlord wrote:
Do you think Owl was better handled by Waid and Brubaker?

Not really. Under Brubaker, the Owl was a slightly more bloodthirsty and sloppy version of the Kingpin. He was clearly a secondary villain and easily manipulated.

I think when the Owl first appeared in Waid's run, he showed enormous potential to be a fearsome villain, but that potential was never realized. It also didn't help that the climax of the Owl story coincided with Matt's decision to wear a red three-piece suit. **shudder**

I don't know if there has ever been a truly great Owl story. I think his potential to develop into something great was hampered by Miller's decision to import the Kingpin into Daredevil's world. It's funny, because, the Owl pre-dates the Kingpin, but Fisk has completely usurped the Owl's modus operandi.

I guess if I had to pick a depiction of the Owl, perhaps the one in Daredevil/Spider-Man. He was pretty creepy there. On the other hand, he was a somewhat sympathetic character in a team-up with the Vulture against Daredevil and Spider-Man (Amazing Spider-Man #396, Spectacular Spider-Man #219). I think no single writer has defined his character, and that's a big problem.


Well you can't really blame Bendis for how he writes Owl, considering other writers write him a similar way.

I think the story from the 90s, covered in Daredevil 301 to 303, that first turned Owl into an animalstic psycho is kinda interesting, its one of the first stories that treated Owl like a character, rather then a archetype.

Also despite it being a comedic book and having some fun at Owl's expense, Superior Foes presented Owl as a very creepy crime boss, more interested in sadism in then profit, who has one of his men fed to rats and threatened to cut off the legs of some super villains who tried to steal from him. He also managed to out smart Boomerang in the last issue.

I actually think its good to have more then one crime boss in a noir title, when you have a gang war you need more then one side and I would argue Owl is more of a dynamic character then Injun Joe or Kingpin's old lieutenants. Look how many serial killer villains Batman has, villains can play similar roles, if you give them more sutble contrasts.

I think making Owl more unstable then Kingpin (who is that not stable, considering Fisk kills his own men for petty reasons) can make him a contrast to Fisk.

I think making Owl a Kingpin wannabe kinda works, he is jealous of Fisk and wants to be him, but he has no interest in trying to make the public like him and wants to cut corners to get to the top faster. Owl thinks he can beat Fisk if he is is twice as violent, twice as ruthless. If Kingpin kills 15 people to get the job done, Owl will kill 50 people to prove he is "scarier" then Fisk.

Owl can never succeed in dethroning Fisk, but the fact he wants to prove his worth through violence, can make him dangerous.

I do think Waid was using the Silver Age Owl, with a few flashes of the more modern version.
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Mike Murdock
Lowlife


Joined: 08 Sep 2014
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PostPosted: Sun Feb 05, 2017 10:19 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Happy Super Bowl everybody!

Daredevil Vol. 2 # 43 - Lowlife Part 3



Quote:
“Lowlife” continues with two mind-blowing, pulse-racing issues this month! Matt Murdock’s defense of his secret identity takes a huge turn for the worse! (Retailers: Don’t forget the new readers who jumped onboard with the 25-cent issue!)


Due 2/11
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The Overlord
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Joined: 22 Aug 2004
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PostPosted: Sun Feb 05, 2017 3:56 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Now this is where this story suffers from typical Bendis problems, the last issue seems positively moving at lighting speed compared to this issue.

This issue spends too much time on long conversations that do not advance the plot, Owl doesn't even bother appearing in this issue and he is the central antagonist of the story.

So what happens: the police talk to the lawyer representing the owner of the Globe about his murder, Matt talks to Milla, where she flirts and he denies being DD, Matt talks to Foggy again about the dangers of being DD after getting outed by the press and about the problems posed by the Owl's takeover, DD takes out some random drug dealers and then Matt is charged with the murder of the Globe's owner.

The conversations between Milla and Matt are fine, the stuff with the Globe's lawyer expands a plot point, but the conservation between Matt and Foggy just came off as a retread of past Bendis conversations between those two and Cage came off as pretentious jerk in his conservation, like he is some angry teenager accusing someone else "selling out to the man". Why is Cage just acting so needlessly angry and aggressive? I understand the point of this conservation, to encourage DD to remain the hero of Hell's Kitchen and not hand off his problems to other heroes, but Cage could have said without coming across like a jerk.

Really this issue could have used a nice action scene to break up the talking heads, DD shutting down Owl's main drug distribution center and bating up several of his henchmen, instead of beating up a few random dealers near the end of the issue. That was hardly an action scene and had no connection to the main plot with Owl. I don't mind talking heads if they are interesting and advance plot, but I am reading Daredevil, not a comic book adaption of "My Dinner With Andre".

The cliffhanger was nice, but this issue spent too much time meandering. This issue gets 2 and half stars, this issue is a let down compared to the last one.


Last edited by The Overlord on Sun Feb 05, 2017 6:36 pm; edited 1 time in total
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