Daredevil Message Board

straygoat · Flying Blind Joined: 07 Apr 2006 Posts: 14 Location: UK

I didn't once complain about Bendis because I thought at long last, something fresh. That's my whole problem with the return to the status quo - it gives us nothing to think about or anticipate because you know that by the end of the arc, pretty much everything will be the same as it was when it started.

I just feel that at the end of Bendis' run, there were lots of different opportunities to explore and in the end, they went for the safest and least interesting. And Foggy nearly dying was lame - yet another back from the dead character.

As for Matt being noble and honest...well, not really. Of all the heroes, he is probably the most flawed and inconsistent because he works to uphold the law and then acts as a vigilante to make sure justice is served. He has always been a character torn between what is legally right and morally right. Besides, what else would he do in that situation? Admit it and put everyone he knows at risk?

Oh well, I'll keep track of DD in Wizard or something and maybe start buying the TPBs again in a year or so. I really don't have any interest in standard, let's use Matt's senses to track down a villain, have a fight, Matt prevails storylines.

Dimetre · Posted: Fri Apr 27, 2007 2:36 pm Post subject:

straygoat · Flying Blind Joined: 07 Apr 2006 Posts: 14 Location: UK

I can see where you are coming from, but I think Bendis' run has made the return to the status quo even more jarring for me...it just seemed that a Marvel title was going to become a little edgier and more unpredicatble for a while and it got my hopes up. That is my main problem with comics (not just DD) these days - apart from the indie press, they are just too predictable.

I know what you're going to say - read indie titles then. I do, but I still love the Marvel characters from my childhood...I just wish they had developed and matured over time (like I have I guess).

Oh and for the record, yes I would have preferred it if Foggy was stabbed and killed. It would have meant a permanent change in Matt's life and something of consequence came out of the entire Bendis run.

james castle · Posted: Fri Apr 27, 2007 7:08 pm Post subject:

Neilan · Posted: Fri Apr 27, 2007 9:40 pm Post subject:

The contradiction, (I would prefer the term counterpoint) is that Matt breaks the law as Daredevil and upholds the law as a lawyer. His personality is somewhat of a yin/yang. No, he's not a villain, or total lawbreaker, but he does as Daredevil, what no other officer of the court, other than She-Hulk, can do. This is a huuge appeal of the character, I believe, even for those who don't recognize it. It is what keeps most of us coming back for more, almost no matter who is at the helm.

Just because other characters break the law, that doesn't make it right. Daredevil can get to the truth without following the rules that Matt Murdock has to. This is why I like my DD edgy. Which way will he go? The suspense is killing me. Twisted Evil

_________________
It's never too late to have a happy childhood!

rgj · Posted: Fri Apr 27, 2007 9:58 pm Post subject:

jc, is 100% right, and I hope he continues to spank these kids who obviousy don't know what they are talking about.

Is Matt "flawed?" Yeah, sure, he's human. He makes mistakes. But, at his core he is a noble man. He believes in the law. Justice. And, defends the weak from the aggressor (which is why he goes up against the Punisher too). These are the things that drive him to be the fighter he is (didn't someone say that at his core he was a fighter Wink

).

For heaven's sake, not only do friends like Ben Urich describe Matt as noble, but his arch ememy, the Kingpin, also says Matt is noble (which is probably one of the reasons KP loves to hate him so). Heck, even Mephisto took exception to Matt's nobility, and compared him to the Silver Surfer (a noble but flawed being himself).

Again, is he flawed? The guy is noble to a fault, so yeah, he's flawed! Look, this is a man, a hero, who has saved the lives, and showed mercy on his most vile enemies (Bulls on the subway). His compassion for the memory of Vanessa Fisk (not to mention his own sense of penance for his culpability in her downfall) took on more importance than his feeling of hatred to her husband. His feelings of remorse for "defeating" Typhoid Mary and getting her comitted afterwards, during Last Rites, is the very definiton of a "good" man. The heart of a good man. And, also in Last Rites, he freakin' defeated the Kingpin with words. "I forgive you." (I think KP may hate him more for those words than any punch Matt ever threw at him and connected with). Crap, if that ain't noble, I don't know what is.

Are we all reading the same comic? I supose someone is going to argue that Matt is a womanizer too. Like MSJ and Sacred Cow Kevin Smith (thanks, Scott!). These fools obviously aren't reading the same comic.

rgj

Murdock Bell · Flying Blind Joined: 26 Mar 2005 Posts: 87

james castle · Posted: Sat Apr 28, 2007 3:57 pm Post subject:

What the devil does everything think Spider-man is doing? Or Batman? Or Superman? Oh yeah, THEY'RE UPHOLDING THE LAW. What? They break the law as a means of upholding the law? Wow, what a neat and original and exciting contradiction. What's the word for someone who up holds the law but breaks it while doing it? Vigilant-something? Do you know who breaks the law even though they're trying to uphold it? EVERY SUPERHERO WHO EVER EXISTED.

As for Matt being a lawyer: guess what? Lawyers aren't any more or less bound by the law. Taking an oath to up hold the law is meaningless. Everyone has to respect the law like it or not.

Lawyers are not bound to uphold the law either. If Matt was a DA, maybe, maybe you guys would have an argument. But he isn't and he never has been. Lawyers smash laws for god's sake. No other profession allows you to do that.

As for Matt being able to do stuff as Daredevil that no other lawyer can. Well, Matt does stuff as Daredevil that no other lawyer can do. That's true. But he also does stuff as Daredevil that no other dentist could do, or photographer could do, or spot welder could do, or priest could do. For the sake of brievity let's all agree that Matt does stuff as Daredevil that no other person (who isn't a superhero) could do.

To recap, you guys are saying:

"Daredevil is neat and original and conflicted because:
1. He breaks the law while trying to enforce them. Just like every other superhero.
2. He's a superhero."

Good work.
_________________
JC

So why can't you see the funny side?
Why aren't you laughing?

Francesco · Underboss Joined: 08 Jun 2006 Posts: 1307

james castle · Posted: Sat Apr 28, 2007 4:21 pm Post subject:

Neilan · Posted: Sat Apr 28, 2007 4:33 pm Post subject:

rgj · Posted: Sat Apr 28, 2007 6:42 pm Post subject:

You know, I really like how everyone here feels that lawyers (the ones that aren't vigilantes) are so eithical in "up holding the law." It's cute in it's naivete.

Look, Matt has never REPRESENTED a client and behind his back try to bring him down as DD (correct me if I'm wrong). Usually, Matt's DD activities usually go hand in hand with defending his client. Where is the hypocrisy there?

You know, if you really think about it, has Matt ever defended a client he knew was guilty? I mean, clients can't lie to him. If you think about it, it may be more "unethical" for Matt to refuse council because he knows (via the DD powers) someone is guilty. Yeah, that sounds absurd, but isn't EVERYONE (like O.J.) entitled to a fair (fairly represented) trial? Then again, I'm not a lawyer, so maybe I'm way off base here.

Seems to me that Matt (vigilante and all) is more respectful of the law than most "ordinary" lawyers. Because, in the end, he tries to be altrustic and seek real justice.

rgj

Murdock Bell · Flying Blind Joined: 26 Mar 2005 Posts: 87

Murdock Bell · Flying Blind Joined: 26 Mar 2005 Posts: 87

Neilan · Posted: Sat Apr 28, 2007 9:14 pm Post subject:

The Message Board is currently in read-only mode, as the software is now out of date. Several features and pages have been removed. If/When I get time I intend to re-launch the board with updated software.