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Daredevil Message Board The Board Without Fear!
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brnsch666 Flying Blind
Joined: 14 Feb 2007 Posts: 1
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Posted: Wed Feb 28, 2007 1:24 pm Post subject: Problems with Bru's DD |
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This is my first post. Sorry it isn't on a positive note, I just need to get something off my chest. Brubakers DD isn't doing it for me. How come DD couldn't immediatly tell he was confronting Iron Fist in 87? It is eluded to that Matt doesn't want DD to be seen in Europe, yet he wears the costume there. He could have just worn a black suit or something. Everyone just seems to eat Brubakers stuff up, I just don't seem to be enjoying it as much as the hype said I should. Punisher's role was just a ridiculous plot devise, Matt was out of character teaming with him the way he did. It can be said that prison changed Matt, but he wasn't even there that long. This makes me miss Bendis on DD. |
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james castle Devil in Cell-Block D
Joined: 30 Jul 2004 Posts: 1999 Location: Toronto, Ontario
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Posted: Wed Feb 28, 2007 1:49 pm Post subject: |
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I agree. In fact, it's sort of stupid for DD to wear a costume at all. How would a bright red costume actually help him fighting crime? Surely a simple black costume makes more sense. Even if he did have a red costume, why in the world would he take the time to actually fashion little horns? What are they made of? Plastic? Where did he get the mold and the plastic to make such perfect little horns? More importantly why would he bother? Speaking of which, why would he bother putting the "DD" on his chest? Again, how does he even do that in the first place? Does he have some kind of silkscreening set up in his place? Don't people think it's weird that a blind guy has an interest in silk screening? Where does he get boots that match his pants?
Bru clearly sucks. _________________ JC
So why can't you see the funny side?
Why aren't you laughing? |
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Forrest Lowlife
Joined: 07 Dec 2004 Posts: 1439
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Posted: Wed Feb 28, 2007 3:04 pm Post subject: Re: Problems with Bru's DD |
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Welcome to the board!
My 2 cents:
brnsch666 wrote: | It is eluded to that Matt doesn't want DD to be seen in Europe, yet he wears the costume there. |
For the fans. That and he'd been through ALOT! So, I'm sure he needed to mental boost as much as the fans did. He was out for revenge/justice. He might have wanted whoever was responsible Foggy's "death" to know he's coming for them.
brnsch666 wrote: | Punisher's role was just a ridiculous plot devise, Matt was out of character teaming with him the way he did. It can be said that prison changed Matt, but he wasn't even there that long. This makes me miss Bendis on DD. |
It wasn't just prison. He thought that his best friend since college had been killed just outside his grasp because he was helplessly locked in prison for being a superhero. THAT will put anyone out of character. Couple this with Milla showing up and Matt starts to realize that the few people he cares for who are still alive are open targets while he's in jail. He was very desperate to get out. Because Brubaker's DD is not just a victim of circumstances, he did something.
I liked the Punisher angle because despite their conflicts, Frank still respects Matt and he doesn't want Matt's life to become the hell that Frank lives. There is a lot of depth in what Brubaker did with Frank. I personally wouldn't consider this a ridiculous plot point. _________________ "Flash is back. Worlds will die again!" |
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Darediva Wake Up
Joined: 29 Jul 2004 Posts: 1208 Location: Hell's Kitchen South, Arkansas, USA
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Posted: Wed Feb 28, 2007 5:12 pm Post subject: |
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james castle wrote: | I agree. In fact, it's sort of stupid for DD to wear a costume at all. How would a bright red costume actually help him fighting crime? Surely a simple black costume makes more sense. Even if he did have a red costume, why in the world would he take the time to actually fashion little horns? What are they made of? Plastic? Where did he get the mold and the plastic to make such perfect little horns? More importantly why would he bother? Speaking of which, why would he bother putting the "DD" on his chest? Again, how does he even do that in the first place? Does he have some kind of silkscreening set up in his place? Don't people think it's weird that a blind guy has an interest in silk screening? Where does he get boots that match his pants?
Bru clearly sucks. |
JC...don't you remember that Spidey asked DD just that? Why the corny horns? Babe magnets, dude.
I'm still wondering how he fashioned that first billy club, the one with the electronic snooping device, all by himself.
Clearly, the whole concept is suspect. But, dammit, I still like to read me some Daredevil, after all these years. _________________ Alice
Those who throw dirt merely lose ground. |
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Forrest Lowlife
Joined: 07 Dec 2004 Posts: 1439
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Posted: Wed Feb 28, 2007 6:09 pm Post subject: |
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Darediva wrote: | I'm still wondering how he fashioned that first billy club, the one with the electronic snooping device, all by himself. |
I think superheroes from the Silver Age were all grand master engineers!
...Didn't one of those Silver Age issues have a full page diagram of Matt's billy club and how it works? ...maybe that was even a Miller issue... I forget.
Yeah, we read stories about adults who swing from the skyscrapers of NYC in tights. At the same time, if I had superpowers, you better believe I'd have a costume! Probably sans-tights, though. _________________ "Flash is back. Worlds will die again!" |
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Darediva Wake Up
Joined: 29 Jul 2004 Posts: 1208 Location: Hell's Kitchen South, Arkansas, USA
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Posted: Wed Feb 28, 2007 6:13 pm Post subject: |
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If "ridiculous plot devices" were the criteria for me not reading a comic book, I would not read ANY comic books...or watch many movies either. I believe that's why it's called fantasy or science fiction.
Beam me up, Scotty. _________________ Alice
Those who throw dirt merely lose ground. |
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fox_limbo Humanity's Fathom
Joined: 01 Aug 2004 Posts: 335
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Posted: Wed Feb 28, 2007 6:16 pm Post subject: |
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james castle wrote: | why would he bother putting the "DD" on his chest? Again, how does he even do that in the first place? Does he have some kind of silkscreening set up in his place? Don't people think it's weird that a blind guy has an interest in silk screening?... |
Silkscreening? Really??! Hmm... and here I thought Matt had an affinity for embroidery.
"DD" on his chest = "Designated Driver"
'Nuff Said. |
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james castle Devil in Cell-Block D
Joined: 30 Jul 2004 Posts: 1999 Location: Toronto, Ontario
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Posted: Wed Feb 28, 2007 10:01 pm Post subject: |
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Forrest wrote: | Darediva wrote: | I'm still wondering how he fashioned that first billy club, the one with the electronic snooping device, all by himself. |
I think superheroes from the Silver Age were all grand master engineers!
...Didn't one of those Silver Age issues have a full page diagram of Matt's billy club and how it works? ...maybe that was even a Miller issue... I forget.
Yeah, we read stories about adults who swing from the skyscrapers of NYC in tights. At the same time, if I had superpowers, you better believe I'd have a costume! Probably sans-tights, though. |
There are much, much bigger problems with DD's clubs: their size. Imagine a club that fits against your thigh like DD's. It clearly starts lower than the hip and ends higher than his knee. It would be what? A foot long at the very, very most? Now imagine two of them...now you have two feet. What do you have? The world's smallest cane, that's what. DD's six feet tall, the little mini-cane would come up just past his knee. He'd be walking around all hunched over trying to tap the ground with his little half-cane.
As for the tights...sorry Forrest: heroes wear tights. _________________ JC
So why can't you see the funny side?
Why aren't you laughing? |
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Acerbus Flying Blind
Joined: 11 Mar 2006 Posts: 96 Location: U.S.A.
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Posted: Thu Mar 01, 2007 2:35 am Post subject: |
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It's been a great run so far, but I think the total reversal of Bendis' 'Out' concept was probably a misstep. I really liked the dynamic of him being outed by the press alot, but it wasn't until Murdock Papers, and maybe the attack by Typhoid Mary (and who could forget, the Yakuza?) a bit earlier that it began to really pay off. Brubaker basically wiped that slate clean, and zeroed out a monumental run on the comic.
I agree about the Punisher plot device, also. The Daredevil I know would figure out a way to escape and keep Frank behind bars somehow. Maybe use him to get out, then set a trap for him or some such. That seems a bit more cerebral and 'Daredevil-ish'. |
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Forrest Lowlife
Joined: 07 Dec 2004 Posts: 1439
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Posted: Thu Mar 01, 2007 5:32 pm Post subject: |
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I always seem to disagree with you.
No offense, it's just comic opinion. Anyway:
Acerbus wrote: | It's been a great run so far, but I think the total reversal of Bendis' 'Out' concept was probably a misstep. |
A total reversal would be a mistake. Marvel/Kesel did a total reversal of Matt's first outing. That outing was never mentioned again. However, this is certainly not Brubaker's approach. In issue #93, he made it quite clear that while Matt received a legal reversal (for the time being), he will never have a "total reversal" of his outing in public opinion. Matt being out of prison and free to practice law is not a total reversal. (Bendis had Matt practicing law, post-"Out." The legal reversal in #93 is a reversal on "The Murdock Papers," the arc of Matt's legal outing, not "Out," the arc of Matt's public opinion outing.)
Acerbus wrote: | The Daredevil I know would figure out a way to escape and keep Frank behind bars somehow. Maybe use him to get out, then set a trap for him or some such. That seems a bit more cerebral and 'Daredevil-ish'. |
Matt's main concern was getting Foggy's killers and protecting his loved ones. With Milla showing up at the prison, etc., he was under pressure and time was a factor. From his perspective, time/resources to set up a trap for Castle meant time/resources taken away from finding Foggy's killer and protecting Milla, Becky, etc. The later clearly took priority. _________________ "Flash is back. Worlds will die again!" |
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train Guardian Devil
Joined: 29 Jul 2004 Posts: 659 Location: Hell's Pantry
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Posted: Thu Mar 01, 2007 11:10 pm Post subject: |
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Forrest wrote: | At the same time, if I had superpowers, you better believe I'd have a costume! Probably sans-tights, though. |
Hrmmm...Forrest-devil: The Man Without Pants. Has a nice ring to it. |
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MercifulAvatar Playing to the Camera
Joined: 27 Apr 2005 Posts: 117 Location: NEO, US
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Posted: Sun Mar 04, 2007 10:40 am Post subject: Re: Problems with Bru's DD |
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brnsch666 wrote: | How come DD couldn't immediately tell he was confronting Iron Fist in 87? |
I think this is a valid point. I'm re-reading the Nocenti and Chichester runs and one way Matt flexes his superpowers in those is by identifying unique heartbeat "signatures" and matching them to individuals. It should have been obvious to DD who was in that counterfeit suit the moment he was close enough to hear the imposter's ticker! _________________ Poser |
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rgj Hardcore
Joined: 29 Jul 2004 Posts: 1580 Location: The Rio Grande Valley of Texas
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Posted: Sun Mar 04, 2007 12:06 pm Post subject: |
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I wasn't going to post on this topic, but since it hasn't died I thought maybe I should. First, yes, 666's points are valid, namely the:
1) DD should have known it was Danny Rand in the costume, blocks before he got to him and
2) the wearing of the costume in Europe.
These were two observations I mentioned during the Current Issue of DD Review threads.
But, I guess you guys weren't paying attention because Bru actually commented on these things (among other things, like a closed casket at a funeral). Bru mentioned that sometimes writers have to eschew logic (like Matt chosing to wear the costume in Europe) in order to move a story along, but they never try to compromise the story.
Ultimately, I can forgive these lapses in logic because the stories were very good.
Still, yes, these lapses in story logic can be very distracting. For instance, if you had a story where the Chameleon was posing as a friend of Peter's, yet his spider sense didn't go off throughout the story and then the writer said it was omitted just so he could have a real boss story, well, that would take away from the story. This is kind of what happened with Matt not recognizing Danny. Sure, Bru can claim that his senses were "distracted." But, that would be rubbish. If Matt could concetrate enough to find Danny he should be able to identify him. But, as I said, I can look the other way because the story arc was good. Maybe not great, anymore, but still very good.
I can agree to disagree with Brubaker regarding some of the details. But, I can also agree that, so far, Bru has done a wonderful job on DAREDEVIL.
RGJ |
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MercifulAvatar Playing to the Camera
Joined: 27 Apr 2005 Posts: 117 Location: NEO, US
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Posted: Sun Mar 04, 2007 12:24 pm Post subject: |
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train wrote: | Hrmmm...Forrest-devil: The Man Without Pants. Has a nice ring to it. |
Well played! _________________ Poser |
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Forrest Lowlife
Joined: 07 Dec 2004 Posts: 1439
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Posted: Mon Mar 05, 2007 1:25 pm Post subject: |
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train wrote: | Forrest wrote: | At the same time, if I had superpowers, you better believe I'd have a costume! Probably sans-tights, though. |
Hrmmm...Forrest-devil: The Man Without Pants. Has a nice ring to it. |
Eeeeee.... Now, that is fearless! _________________ "Flash is back. Worlds will die again!" |
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