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DAREDEVIL #22 Preview, Reviews and Discussion
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What did you think of DAREDEVIL #22?
5
33%
 33%  [ 2 ]
4
50%
 50%  [ 3 ]
3
0%
 0%  [ 0 ]
2
16%
 16%  [ 1 ]
Total Votes : 6

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Kuljit Mithra
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PostPosted: Fri Sep 18, 2020 2:09 pm    Post subject: DAREDEVIL #22 Preview, Reviews and Discussion Reply with quote

DAREDEVIL #22 by Zdarsky, Mobili, Olazaba, Iacono, Cowles comes out next week, and here's the cover by Checchetto



Here's the preview link: http://www.manwithoutfear.com/gallery/Daredevil-V6-022

Please use this thread for all discussion when the issue ships!
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Daredevil24
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PostPosted: Wed Sep 23, 2020 6:48 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

This was easily 4/5 outside of bringing back the world's most annoying character in DD history. Can't wait to see what Iron Man has in store for Matt. You've got Iron Fist and Luke Cage smashing Shield Hellicarriers out the sky and fighting cosmic level bad guys. Matt could use a little upgrade.
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Dimetre
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PostPosted: Wed Sep 23, 2020 7:42 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I also gave this a score of four.

It's another great Chip Zdarsky issue. Wilson and Matt have very clear motivations, and Zdarsky is still making ample use of the theme of control, having Typhoid overtly referencing it this issue. We weren't told why Fisk went to see her and how he plans to have her meddle in Daredevil's case, but something is going to go down.

It was heart-warming to see Matt show such a appreciation to Foggy this issue. It's bothered me in the recent past how much Daredevil uses him without even considering how Foggy feels about it.

My favourite part of this issue was Matt's request to Tony. It's probably the most politically-charged passage Zdarsky has penned yet. It plainly addresses the massive income inequality of the present moment, and how the rich have the power to remedy that problem, but won't unless there's a profit in sight.

Quote:
Tony: ...you can't just come in here and ask me to throw away billions of dollars in order to -- what -- "win" against people who won't even notice it happening?

Matt: Yeah. I can. Because it's the right thing to do. You're giving people homes. Security. You're not "throwing away billions." If you don't do this, everyone will be displaced. Some will end up on the streets.

That was such a bold request, and Matt's right. Poor people are getting poorer and their lives are more and more in danger because the people who have the most won't act unless there is something of benefit to them. Tony is a good man, but Matt is asking him to break a cycle that is difficult for the rich to break -- to do the right thing and expect nothing in return.

I'm a little worried about Tony's offer of the "upgrade." We know that Matt isn't 100%, so a temporary upgrade makes sense, but we saw Matt in an armour during the 90s, and it sucked. I like how Matt is unprotected when he fights. It goes with his name "Daredevil." He takes risks, and shows no concern for his well-being. If Tony does lend him an armour, I expect it to be very temporary, although I'm sure there will always be a segment of the fandom that will never shut up about it once it makes its appearance.

As for the old friend who appears in the cliffhanger, I'm curious how she'll be handled under Zdarsky's pen. I have no reason to doubt his ability to write any area of Daredevil's world. I wasn't her biggest fan during the Waid era, especially when the story relocated to San Francisco, but I'm all for smart and confident female characters.

I didn't love Francesco Mobili's art. To be sure, he draws better than I ever could, but he kind of reminded me of David Ross, in that some faces change from panel to panel. Victor Olazaba's inks and shading look great, and both he and Mobili manage to impress on some pages, but Checchetto is a hard act to follow.

This issue is one of many Marvel comics this week to have the memorial to Chadwick Boseman at the top of the cover. It's still so very sad. May he rest in power.
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macjr33
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PostPosted: Wed Sep 23, 2020 9:53 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

LOVED this issue! While there might not have been a ton of action there were interesting things going on with every character.

Dimetere, completely agree with you on how Foggy was handled. That was one thing that bothered me about Soule's run is that he didn't know how to represent Matt and Foggy's friendship. Their friendship is such a compelling part of Dardevil's canon and Zdarsky does a great job representing that here. Also, I appreciate when emphasis is placed on Foggy's exceptional capabilities as lawyer.

Really enjoyed his conversation with Tony. I agree with you too Dimetere that the request was bold but needed. Tony has power beyond his intellect and his Iron Man suits and he should use it. Loved how Matt made the comment at about being "people level" hero, such a great line. Matt has always cared so much about his city and the people in it. It may be often overlooked, but Matt growing up poor and seeing what happened to his father made such a mark on him that someone like a Tony could never understand. Even though Matt became a successful lawyer, he never forgets where he came from and I love that about him.

If he does get an armor upgrade I hope it only temporary and for a very specific purpose. Could be cool to see a Daredevil inspired Iron Man suit, but again only briefly.

Really excited to see what Fisk has planned especially as he seems to be diving back into the crime world. Also, the panels with Typhoid Mary may be my favorite of her that are not written by Nocenti.

I may be the dissenting opinion here, but I am so stoked that Kirsten is back. As someone who loved Waid's run, I thought she was a perfect fit for Matt and loved the relationship between them. She was smart, confident and wasn't afraid to challenge Matt, yet accepted him both as Matt and as Daredevil. She understood the risks of being with him and yet she accepted it. Plus, it was just nice to see Matt in a relatively healthy and stable relationship particularly by his standards. I am curious to see how Zdarsky handles her as he done a great job with other characters he has brought in so I am sure it will continue here. Also, given her memory was wiped there as to be a reveal again at some point.

I too think the art wasn't great; however, that may just because I have been blown away by nearly every issue that Checchetto has drawn that it sets unfair expectations for any other artist.

Easy 5/5 for me!
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fubarthepanda
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PostPosted: Fri Sep 25, 2020 9:31 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Yeah, wasn't as excited about this issue as everyone else. Didn't realize how silly the new Daredevil costume was until it was rendered by Mobili. Checchetto can make it work thanks to the more stylistic art style, but DD kind of looks like a homeless bag lady with the cargo pants and boxing tape.

But what really put me off was the conversation with Iron Man. It wouldn't take billions to buy Hell's Kitchen, but hundreds of billions, so once again utopian ideas collide with the brick wall of economic reality. The bottom line is that living in one of the most expensive places on earth is... expensive. (I lived there for 15 years on a good salary and it wasn't easy.)

I continue to like, however, the portrayal of Foggy and the Kingpin, and agree that the return of Kristen is a welcome callback to the Waid run (although I would have preferred Dakota North).

A little apprehensive about the upcoming prison storyline that has been teased -- pretty sure we don't need another one of those...
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Dimetre
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PostPosted: Sat Sep 26, 2020 10:25 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

fubarthepanda wrote:
But what really put me off was the conversation with Iron Man. It wouldn't take billions to buy Hell's Kitchen, but hundreds of billions, so once again utopian ideas collide with the brick wall of economic reality. The bottom line is that living in one of the most expensive places on earth is... expensive. (I lived there for 15 years on a good salary and it wasn't easy.)

I get what you're typing, but if Matt doesn't ask Tony to do this, then how else do you stop people like the Stromwyns?
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macjr33
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PostPosted: Sun Sep 27, 2020 1:22 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Dimetre wrote:
fubarthepanda wrote:
But what really put me off was the conversation with Iron Man. It wouldn't take billions to buy Hell's Kitchen, but hundreds of billions, so once again utopian ideas collide with the brick wall of economic reality. The bottom line is that living in one of the most expensive places on earth is... expensive. (I lived there for 15 years on a good salary and it wasn't easy.)

I get what you're typing, but if Matt doesn't ask Tony to do this, then how else do you stop people like the Stromwyns?


I agree with Dimetre and have a couple other thoughts as well.

I am willing to suspend my disbelief a bit and chalk it up to NYC in the Marvel Universe is different than in real life. Plus Zdarsky does try to explain it that because of the criminal activity property values have gone down. Basically if the Stromwyns can do it so can Tony.

Maybe an alternative could have been for him to go to not just Tony, but maybe Danny as well (not sure he knows anyone else with that kind of money); however, the conversation with Tony was just so good I can why you would just want to have it be with him.
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fubarthepanda
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PostPosted: Tue Sep 29, 2020 2:17 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Dimetre wrote:
fubarthepanda wrote:
But what really put me off was the conversation with Iron Man. It wouldn't take billions to buy Hell's Kitchen, but hundreds of billions, so once again utopian ideas collide with the brick wall of economic reality. The bottom line is that living in one of the most expensive places on earth is... expensive. (I lived there for 15 years on a good salary and it wasn't easy.)

I get what you're typing, but if Matt doesn't ask Tony to do this, then how else do you stop people like the Stromwyns?


The Stromwyns are obviously criminals, which is a major difference between them and other megarich people like Tony. It's not just about money -- they are willing to kill, bribe and blackmail to reach their goals. Both DD and the Kingpin have underestimated the level of their scheming and the systemic corruption that they have bought, so to think that you can just buy your way out of the problem is really magical thinking. My guess is that Zdarsky is playing a long-game where DD and the Kingpin will have to bury the hatchet and team-up in order to beat the Stromwyns at their own game (perhaps Tony's money will help them in some way). But the whole "just give billions of dollars away" thinking rubbed me the wrong way -- long-term problems aren't solved by throwing money at them (and, in this case, good luck with property tax, building maintenance and the thousand other expenses that come with operating real estate in Manhattan if you just give it away...)
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Orpheus007
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PostPosted: Wed Sep 30, 2020 4:47 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Really dug the issue. I'm a sucker for the old, so bringing back characters from prior runs is always fun. Stoked on the fresh look of Typhoid, not so much on what Kirsten will bring to the table.

Everyone assumes Tony will build a new (albeit temporary) armor, and that's most likely the case. I know I am in the huge minority, but I dug the 90's armored look and I hope we get to see something new that calls back to that.

But ya know what would be even better? Tony building an Iron Daredevil drone to patrol the streets while DD is locked up.
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macjr33
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PostPosted: Wed Sep 30, 2020 10:15 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Orpheus007 wrote:
Really dug the issue. I'm a sucker for the old, so bringing back characters from prior runs is always fun. Stoked on the fresh look of Typhoid, not so much on what Kirsten will bring to the table.

Everyone assumes Tony will build a new (albeit temporary) armor, and that's most likely the case. I know I am in the huge minority, but I dug the 90's armored look and I hope we get to see something new that calls back to that.

But ya know what would be even better? Tony building an Iron Daredevil drone to patrol the streets while DD is locked up.


Curious, why are you not as excited about Kirsten being back? Did you like Waid's run overall?

That's an interesting idea about a drone protecting Hell's Kitchen if Matt is in prison. It maybe a nice alternative to Matt getting his own suit.
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fubarthepanda
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PostPosted: Thu Oct 01, 2020 11:39 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Arg, hope the upcoming prison tease is a misdirection. Do we really need Matt to be convicted of murder or manslaughter? We've already seen him have a nervous breakdown and have an affair with a married woman -- do we need to knock his moral character down any further? At what point do we just stop caring about the character because he's basically become irredeemable? (Marvel has already turned me off to Iron Man, Moon Knight and many of my other favorites over the years by destroying their characters. They came close with DD and Shadowland, but this might very well be the final nail in the DD coffin for me. Hopefully, Zdarsky has an ace up his sleeve...)
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macjr33
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PostPosted: Thu Oct 01, 2020 1:03 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

fubarthepanda wrote:
Arg, hope the upcoming prison tease is a misdirection. Do we really need Matt to be convicted of murder or manslaughter? We've already seen him have a nervous breakdown and have an affair with a married woman -- do we need to knock his moral character down any further? At what point do we just stop caring about the character because he's basically become irredeemable? (Marvel has already turned me off to Iron Man, Moon Knight and many of my other favorites over the years by destroying their characters. They came close with DD and Shadowland, but this might very well be the final nail in the DD coffin for me. Hopefully, Zdarsky has an ace up his sleeve...)


While I certainly agree that Zdarsky has knocked Matt down a bit, like pretty much every writer post-Miller has done (with maybe the exception of Waid), I would argue that he hasn't had Matt do anything that would make him irredeemable at least compared to what writers have already done to Matt.

For example, I would argue he is doing the moral thing by facing trial for murder/manslaughter. Even though it was an accident, he is holding himself accountable. Unlike during the Bendis run, when his identify was outed and yet he continued to lie about being Daredevil. I certainly understood why he did that, but it certainly wasn't the moral thing to do.

As for the affair with Mindy, while I certainly don't like the fact he was having an affair with a married woman, I was way more bothered with his affair with Dakota and even more so when he cheated on Karen with Typhoid Mary. And while on the subject of his relationships, what about his treatment of Heather Glenn?

I agree that Shadowland was terrible and it's a sentiment that is shared by a lot of Dardevil fans I think. One of the reasons why I hold Waid's run in such high regards is because it was a necessary palette cleanser after Shadowland.

Matt is a flawed character. While his intentions are good and noble, he makes a lot of mistakes. Yet, why I think most of us love him as a character is because despite this, he never gives up and tries to be better. To me the idea of redemption is at the core of Daredevil's mythos, which I love.

I think Zdarsky is doing a great job here and is putting his own unique take on themes that many writers before him have done. My hope is that Kirsten's return is part of what helps to lift Matt back up.
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fubarthepanda
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PostPosted: Thu Oct 01, 2020 1:35 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

The problem is that -- if we take the story at face value so far -- and DD went out to fight crime while he wasn't physically or mentally fit and accidently killed a guy, then it's really no different than someone having one too many drinks and killing a guy with his vehicle. Yes, that person might be redeemable as a human being, but he could never be trusted with alcohol again, just as Matt could never be trusted to be DD again, imo.
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Dimetre
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PostPosted: Thu Oct 01, 2020 4:49 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

fubarthepanda wrote:
The problem is that -- if we take the story at face value so far -- and DD went out to fight crime while he wasn't physically or mentally fit and accidently killed a guy, then it's really no different than someone having one too many drinks and killing a guy with his vehicle. Yes, that person might be redeemable as a human being, but he could never be trusted with alcohol again, just as Matt could never be trusted to be DD again, imo.

Your analogy is interesting, but I'm not sure it works.

Is operating heavy machinery the same as being a superhero? When I drive my car, I feel like I'm using a machine to perform a function. Yes, I got tested when I was younger to earn the privilege to operate this machine, but it's a function that isn't part of my being.

For Matt, I think Zdarsky demonstrated that Matt doesn't really have a choice when it comes to using his powers to look after Hell's Kitchen. He can't help but hear crimes being committed within a large radius from wherever he is. He feels a responsibility to act.

So when I drive a car, I don't think my role as a driver is part of my identity, but I do think Matt's powers and responsibility are very much part of who he is.

Now, if you ingest alcohol, that impairs the judgement you need to be able to operate heavy machinery safely. People could foresee harm coming to both the driver and anyone unfortunate enough to be in the driver's path.

Matt has been trying to recuperate from a nearly fatal injury. He still has his powers, and he still feels the need to do what he can to keep his neighbourhood safe. Is it reasonable to expect that when he was trying to do something heroic, that anyone other than himself would be at risk? I think few people would. His injuries did not seem to impair his powers in any way, or his mental faculties.

So I don't think the analogy works that well.
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fubarthepanda
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PostPosted: Thu Oct 01, 2020 7:30 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I don't have the issue in front of me, but if I remember correctly (a big if!), Matt was impaired. He wasn't recovered from his injuries and his senses and timing were off. As a result, he killed a guy and then spent the next dozen issues beating himself up because he knew he shouldn't have been out there.

But being a super-hero doesn't give him a free pass to kill someone (intentionally or accidently). If any one of us took the law into our own hands (a crime, btw) and killed a person, we'd be in prison for a loooong time faster then a New York minute. If if he feels guilty, I'm not even sure why he's defending himself...

In terms of being a "compulsive vigilante" because of his abilities, he could always retire from the city (he's taken plenty of road trips before) and consign himself to some sort of solitude if he can't control himself from fighting crime.

While the current run appears "cool", I'm worried that it's making DD toxic for the long-run. (Of course, with Mike Murdock and the Norn Stones being introduced in the Annual, there's already a macguffin for undoing this entire mess, which will hopefully come to pass after another year of misery...)
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