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Daredevil #102 (SPOILERS)
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Dimetre
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Joined: 16 Feb 2006
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PostPosted: Wed Nov 28, 2007 3:41 pm    Post subject: Daredevil #102 (SPOILERS) Reply with quote

A strong issue, and some fine exploration of Larry Cranston's character. I particularly liked the part where Larry was sparring in preparation with his upcoming battle with Daredevil.

"These men are the best trainers in the country. Mercenaries and killers... men who fear nothing... Yet they can barely lay a hand on me, no matter how hard they struggle. Subconsciously, they simply don't want to. They pull punches without realizing it. Give me openings they never would otherwise. Will it be the same when I face you? Or will your anger override everything? I almost hope it will. I'd really like to see that."

Brubaker's exploration of Mr. Fear is wonderful. I haven't seen anything like it since Miller's glory days working with Wilson Fisk.

I'm wondering if the Hood is going to send out the Wrecker again. I'd love to see Daredevil keep trying to take him down. Or will the Hood keep sending out an assembly of villains?
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Gloria
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PostPosted: Sat Dec 01, 2007 9:01 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

How many people would still say "Mr. Fear is a lame villain"? Brubaker has successfully turned him into a frightening bastard! he's absolutely hateable, too, for, in the end, all the deaths amd destruction he's causing are based in a silly "Matt stole my lollipop at school" old grudge. My! there's a sick man!

Daredevil is really a man without fear: he finds no less than five super-powered/highly skilled baddies... and what does he do? fight them all!

I was relieved at what seemed to be a small victory for Matt (and, of course, Foggy's lawyer skills being responsible for that)... But the realization that Cranston is still pulling the strings gives me the creeps: Fear is still two steps ahead. Darn it!

That's why i liked the team-work around Matt: It's an overwhelming situation for Matt, so it's good he has people around doing their job. I particularly liked detective Kurtz telling Dakota about an "Ox sighting": it's good for DD to have extra "eyes and ears", something he had in the Kesel years and seems to have been forgotten since. And this is good, for one of Matt's more reliable informers, Ben Urich, seems lost for the series now... Too much hanging around with Sally Floyd?

Earlier, I considered Lily as a victim, but now I definitely suspect she's part of the plan, whether willfully or manipulated: I'm curious to see how it all plays in the end.
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Gloria
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The Overlord
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PostPosted: Sat Dec 01, 2007 10:13 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

As I have said before there are no lame villains, only lame writers (expect maybe Stilt-Man Very Happy ). A villain is as good as the writer makes him. I hope Brubaker uses other classic DD villains (Purple Man, Bushwacker, Mr. Hyde, Typhoid Mary, etc) because he has done good work with Mr. Fear. I think a lot of the Silver Age rogues and Nocenti created villains could easily fit in with the world of the modern DD.
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Gloria
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PostPosted: Sat Dec 01, 2007 10:25 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

The Overlord wrote:
As I have said before there are no lame villains


Hear, hear! I entirely agree. I've been quite annoyed at some complaints ever since Brubaker reintroduced Cranston. While those people said "silly villain, silly name... and anyway who the heck is he?", I thought that Brubaker had something mighty in preparation.

Hey, if they had to diss a villain because he was little known... who would have given a dime for Galactus himself when he first appeared? Characters, good or evil, are rarely immediatly "cool" from a start : it's their development, and how they're written, that makes them good or bad.

And, well, thumbs up to Brubaker for making DD's rogue gallery something beyond the classic DD-Bullseye-Kingping fight. Don't misunderstand me, I think Fisk and Bullseye are excellent DD villains, but overusing them reduces their interest & charm.
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Clayton Blind Love
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PostPosted: Sun Dec 02, 2007 4:06 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

The Wrecker by Michael Lark. Wow! Simply wow! I really enjoyed this scene. Also, I agree about how well Bru is writing Mr. Fear. The training room sequence gave off a vibe which very much reminded me of DD #170 with the Kingpin training in Japan. I just love seeing villains practicing. You never see much of this in comics. Its always the heroes that have to look the part that they need to train all the time. Why not villains? Great issue.

Did anyone else have a chuckle about Miller's short lived creation called "the Hood" in a certain Bat-book this past week? A commment on the BKV creation? Maybe not, but it was still hilarious.

C.
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Gloria
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PostPosted: Sun Dec 02, 2007 6:13 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Clayton Blind Love wrote:
The training room sequence gave off a vibe which very much reminded me of DD #170 with the Kingpin training in Japan. I just love seeing villains practicing. You never see much of this in comics

Yes, you're right. We don't often see all the hard work required to become a proper supervillain Laughing

Still, Kingpin actually did physical training. Cranston cheats. His trainers are afraid to hurt him, and he's free to kick back without restraint: without his drugs, however fit, he wouldn't stand a chance in a fight (and this I hope will happen when Matt comes to him with a gas mask and gives him a good kicking, bwah-hah-hah!)
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Gloria
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"Para la cuesta arriba quiero mi burro, que la cuesta abajo yo me la subo"
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Francesco
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PostPosted: Sun Dec 02, 2007 7:19 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

That's what Batman would do. DD is more likely to voluntarily inhale a lungful of fear gas before the big fight, to give him the handicap.
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Neilan
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PostPosted: Sun Dec 02, 2007 8:02 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Gloria wrote:
Clayton Blind Love wrote:
The training room sequence gave off a vibe which very much reminded me of DD #170 with the Kingpin training in Japan. I just love seeing villains practicing. You never see much of this in comics

Yes, you're right. We don't often see all the hard work required to become a proper supervillain Laughing

Still, Kingpin actually did physical training. Cranston cheats. His trainers are afraid to hurt him, and he's free to kick back without restraint: without his drugs, however fit, he wouldn't stand a chance in a fight (and this I hope will happen when Matt comes to him with a gas mask and gives him a good kicking, bwah-hah-hah!)


I found the training scene confusing for that very reason. What's the point of hiring attackers not to go all out? With my faith in Bru, I can only assume that it's a statement to Cranston's character. He is only comfortable, when the deck is stacked. Villains with a lesser sense of entitlement would work to get better at their weaknesses, and Larry certainly knows that in a strictly one-on-one physical confrontation, he is no match for DD. This is why he will ultimately be brought down, his lack of facing up to his own flaws, which is tied in to his obsession with Matt, will see to it that he makes the fatal mistake.

The thing about the Kingpin is, at least he worked for what he attained. I'm nowhere near seeing him rear his head again, I hope he's gone for a long time, giving us time to get to see and appreciate updated versions of other classic and perhaps even new villains. The Kingpin was a very good villain, back when he was only Spidey's, but Miller transformed him from a massive thug who worked and trained for every advantage, to a Machiavellan manipulator who was almost Shakespearean in his character.
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harryhausen
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PostPosted: Mon Dec 03, 2007 2:44 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Yeah, I liked this issue a lot. I'm getting used to the sort of 'TV feel' that Brubaker and Lark bring. And I mean that in a nice way. Establishing shots and a certain regularity of panel that put the focus on the story and the characters.

My one small complaint, though, is that I'm ready to see Matt kick some serious ass. I understand that he got distracted by the Wrecker (when did he get out of prison? I mean, after the New Avengers recaptured him in that second arc or so?), but I might have thought that he would be keyed into Ox. He's done a fair amount of being in prison and having trouble with Tombstone and getting the short end of it from Melvin and now Fear. I want him to beat someone silly. Or fight 50 ninjas. Or drop Bullseye. Okay, well, I'm just kidding about the last two. But, God, please let him beat the sh!t out of Fear. Please.

Back to the fun: I like how we get issues that continue to defy the 'writing for trades' trend. I read some complaints about the "end" of the previous arc and the Fear reveal there. I laughed. It's awesome. I think of this run as one huge thing, impossible to separate, but not so dense that it would be forbidding to new readers. A rarity.

Oh and, Clayton, I thought the same thing about the Hood idea in that certain "Bat Book" and laughed, too. I wonder what Miller's writing schedule is like (so do comic readers everywhere - and Dan Didio) and if he is throwing elbows a little bit. If so, it's fantastic.
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Gloria
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PostPosted: Mon Dec 03, 2007 5:13 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

harryhausen wrote:
But, God, please let him beat the sh!t out of Fear. Please.

May we collect signatures for that? Cranston's got it coming. I hope that, in the end, Matt leaves him incapacitated to... hum, have any offspring, or something of the sort. Twisted Evil

harryhausen wrote:
Back to the fun: I like how we get issues that continue to defy the 'writing for trades' trend.

Writing for trades? nopes. Brubaker ain't writing for the trades, he's writing for the big, fat, extras-filled DD omnibus we are all waiting and salivating for ever since we saw his Cap omnibus. Wink
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"Para la cuesta arriba quiero mi burro, que la cuesta abajo yo me la subo"
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jumonji
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PostPosted: Mon Dec 03, 2007 1:36 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Gloria wrote:
harryhausen wrote:
But, God, please let him beat the sh!t out of Fear. Please.

May we collect signatures for that? Cranston's got it coming. I hope that, in the end, Matt leaves him incapacitated to... hum, have any offspring, or something of the sort. Twisted Evil


So we're going for a well-placed knee to the crotch then? Wink But seriously, the guy is evil. Ever since I read that latest Bru interview where he said something about the character going to new extremes (or however he put it), I've been thinking that DD might actually kill the guy. I wouldn't have any problems with it morally, but I'd hate to see Matt go back to prison (even though The Devil in Cell Block D was a great story arc...).
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Dimetre
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PostPosted: Mon Dec 03, 2007 2:42 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

jumonji wrote:
Ever since I read that latest Bru interview where he said something about the character going to new extremes (or however he put it), I've been thinking that DD might actually kill the guy. I wouldn't have any problems with it morally, but I'd hate to see Matt go back to prison (even though The Devil in Cell Block D was a great story arc...).

I would have a huge problem with Matt killing Fear. I hated it when Daredevil killed in the movie. The character is motivated primarily by justice, not vengeance. That's one of the things that distinguishes Daredevil in Marvel.

I too want to see Daredevil open a can of whoopass on someone. He's been getting beaten up a lot lately. I don't think he's one a fight decisively since he was in Europe. So, yes, I do want him to really lay a beating on Mr. Fear. I just hope it's with the same acrobatics and skill from his glory days, not sitting on top of the guys stomach and punching him repeatedly in the face like in the Bendis days. I hated that.
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jumonji
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PostPosted: Mon Dec 03, 2007 2:56 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Dimetre wrote:
jumonji wrote:
Ever since I read that latest Bru interview where he said something about the character going to new extremes (or however he put it), I've been thinking that DD might actually kill the guy. I wouldn't have any problems with it morally, but I'd hate to see Matt go back to prison (even though The Devil in Cell Block D was a great story arc...).

I would have a huge problem with Matt killing Fear. I hated it when Daredevil killed in the movie. The character is motivated primarily by justice, not vengeance. That's one of the things that distinguishes Daredevil in Marvel.


While I see your point - and I would certainly prefer it if that kind of development never happened - I think everyone has a breaking point somewhere. In a way, Fear goes beyond just killing someone Matt loves, he's actually playing with his wife the way a cat plays with a mouse, which is just so far beyond twisted. I think it's the feeling that you're losing control of a situation that can make a person desperate enough to do something that's not really in their nature, and I think this situation is dire enough to make Matt lose his cool. Like I said, I hope it doesn't happen, but if it did happen it wouldn't change my view of the character as someone who doesn't (normally) kill. This is a very extreme situation, after all.
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Dimetre
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PostPosted: Mon Dec 03, 2007 3:02 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

jumonji wrote:
While I see your point - and I would certainly prefer it if that kind of development never happened - I think everyone has a breaking point somewhere. In a way, Fear goes beyond just killing someone Matt loves, he's actually playing with his wife the way a cat plays with a mouse, which is just so far beyond twisted. I think it's the feeling that you're losing control of a situation that can make a person desperate enough to do something that's not really in their nature, and I think this situation is dire enough to make Matt lose his cool. Like I said, I hope it doesn't happen, but if it did happen it wouldn't change my view of the character as someone who doesn't (normally) kill. This is a very extreme situation, after all.

But Daredevil has always been involved in extreme situations. He has always had an excuse to blow his top and go crazy, but he has never killed. The fact that he has always retained his self control and never degenerated into a monster has made him more heroic in my view. If he kills Fear it would tarnish the character from my point of view. There is no excuse for him to become the Punisher, whom he has always been opposed to (until recently. Still waiting for that to be corrected.)
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harryhausen
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PostPosted: Mon Dec 03, 2007 4:32 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I always felt that Matt crossed the 'Killer' line when he willfully dropped Bullseye. Even though Bullseye didn't die, Matt flipped out, beat him up real bad, and made the decision to drop him. And I thought it was great.
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